IMDave

To amp, or not to amp ?...that is the question

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Good vid Dan ; 2 subs can certainly help rooms that aren't the right shape . I would place another consideration on which sub is needed for a given room size as do audioholics ;

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Of course a sub capable of playing well in a large room is more than capable of playing well in a small room too, but using a sub with limited output capabilities in a larger room means the sub may not be able to hit reference levels (the loudest intended output playback level)  in such a large listening space.  This can cause the subwoofer to strain and, in so doing, produce audible levels of distortion which is something that should be avoided if your desired goal is clean and accurate reproduction of music and movies in your home theatre

http://www.audioholics.com/loudspeaker-design/subwoofer-room-size

Personally Ive got a velo ultra12+ that goes around flat to 20hz like the twin pbs subs but that doesn't give that visceral organ shifting treat a velo dd or a power sound audio etc can give :D

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@IMDave  not sure if you have seen some CM series pop up for sale,

 

cm centre  2 s2 for $900 half $1799 retail,

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/topic/126881-fs-bowers-and-wilkins-cm-centre2-s2/

and a cm10 s2 at $3800 which normally retail $6.5k ! 

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/topic/126829-fs-bowers-and-wilkins-cm10-s2/?tab=comments#comment-1884573

 

maybe can do a deal for both, though depending if you have had a chance to demo the CM series and liked what you heard :) 

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41 minutes ago, :) al said:

@IMDave  not sure if you have seen some CM series pop up for sale,

 

cm centre  2 s2 for $900 half $1799 retail,

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/topic/126881-fs-bowers-and-wilkins-cm-centre2-s2/

and a cm10 s2 at $3800 which normally retail $6.5k ! 

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/topic/126829-fs-bowers-and-wilkins-cm10-s2/?tab=comments#comment-1884573

 

maybe can do a deal for both, though depending if you have had a chance to demo the CM series and liked what you heard :) 

"Slowly I turned, step by step, inch by inch".................goddamn it...just when I was about to jump ....another option turns up. :lol::lol::lol:

Yes I just saw this listed on SNA a little while ago. Very tempting.

Actually what is worse, is after quite a few years of chasing projector "nirvana" , all this listening to speakers has had me re-visiting my music collection.

Spent the weekend cleaning up the Thorens TD-125 and have just ordered a new cartridge.

SNA is even more dangerous than this place. The " Turntable and Phono Stage" subforum is a rabbit hole of $$$$$$$$.

I've always coveted a tube amp for 2 channel.

http://www.westonacoustics.com/MyImages/Front page_2.jpg

Must close eyes and move away now.LOL.

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Shows my naivety. I'm happy to be corrected by someone who knows more about this stuff, but a bit of research has pointed me towards valve amps being much more compatible with speakers that have a higher sensitivity ( 90+ dB/m/w) and nominal impedances >= 8ohms.

Sure an Audio Research 100 watter will power anything, but a more affordable model like this 20 watt beauty would not be such a good match for my Krix Harmonix mk2's which can drop as low as 3.8ohm with 87dB/m/w.

http://www.westonacoustics.com/service1.html

 

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33 minutes ago, IMDave said:

Shows my naivety. I'm happy to be corrected by someone who knows more about this stuff, but a bit of research has pointed me towards valve amps being much more compatible with speakers that have a higher sensitivity ( 90+ dB/m/w) and nominal impedances >= 8ohms.

Dave I wasnt sure what you had in mind. but back of my mind I thought you were just working out retirement plan for your spendors :D

and I wouldn't be too bothered wiht the sensitivity of the spendors stand mounts tend to have lower sensitivity however the 8 ohm load and not really being so demanding a speaker means they ae likely a very good match for tube amp :)

the only info we have on the spendor's is what cwt posted,

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazine/equipment/0601/spendorsp23e.htm

which seems to declare that while spendor suggest 30 watt minimum that with 30 watts it was capable of some ear splitting stuff and ended up being running quite comfortably with a 300B 8 watt tube jobbies. I am not surprised and tells me its quite a comfortable speaker on low wattage high quality amps including the naim's quoted in the review.

no the krix are not the first speakers id think off to go with a tube amp, but certainly id suggest the spendor a no 1 candidate. so yeah go for it I would say, the earle amps it would seem require a very long wait... we are talking a year plus it would seem ... but there is a troubadour going here and would mean you can jump queue for a new one,

http://www.stereo.net.au/forums/topic/126786-fs-weston-troubadour-6l6-valve-amp/

 

ps I didnt realise you had Krix Harmonix mk2's ? if the case just simple case of adding suitable matching krix centre ? while looking at what the spendors need to boogie, I would be dumb founded quite frankly if the harmonix and matching decent krix centre and krix multi channel rig hanging off your system that something like a decent power amp wouldn't take things further past than what the AVR is capable off :)

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Earle does some very nice amps - highly recommended with suitable speakers.

Having trialled running some big monobloc valve amps for both 2 channel and movies, I'd recommend keeping valve amps for 2 channel only. Your power valves are consumables and typically last 2000 hours max - signal valves in the pre-amp section last much longer - up to 10,000+ hours.

You might consider running a good 2 channel solid state integrated with HT bypass to improve stereo performance.

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10 minutes ago, Quark said:

Having trialled running some big monobloc valve amps for both 2 channel and movies, I'd recommend keeping valve amps for 2 channel only. Your power valves are consumables and typically last 2000 hours max - signal valves in the pre-amp section last much longer - up to 10,000+ hours.

yes depends what dave is upto :D

I agree if expecting to do both 2ch/av best to stick to SS. I know mr osborne runs both 2ch av off valves but he can probably afford to ! :D

and yes if running separate sweet 2ch rig can definitely do 2ch only via some valves ! 

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@IMDave so is the plan still to update the speakers first?   Or has love of valves :wub: totally blown this off course?  :P:D

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10 hours ago, :) al said:

yes depends what dave is upto :D ( as my wife would say," God only knows")

I agree if expecting to do both 2ch/av best to stick to SS. I know mr osborne runs both 2ch av off valves but he can probably afford to ! :D

and yes if running separate sweet 2ch rig can definitely do 2ch only via some valves ! 

Ha,ha sorry guys.Yes, this thread is a bit like Melbourne weather. Changes very quickly.:lol:

So yes, the Spendors are to be retired from my system. ( But be reincarnated in a new HT system I'm setting up for a mate at work. He's getting my old Epson 1080p PJ / Oppo bdp83/ Marantz sr7002/ Spendors & Krix Centrix. Just needs a 2nd hand sub, surrounds and a screen. )

I've ordered the Krix Harmonix mk2 & Vortex mk2 from Selbys, which should arrive by the end of the week. 

On the 2 channel front, I've ordered a new cartridge to replace my ancient Supex ,  am having a phone stage built by a local guy from SNA, and having my Rega RB300 tone arm re-wired. Should be a marked improvement over what I have at the moment. 

If over time I find myself listening to more and more music, I might start a new thread : " Do you really need a separate power & pre- amp for quality 2 channel , or is an integrated enough?" 😂😂😂

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53 minutes ago, IMDave said:

I've ordered the Krix Harmonix mk2 & Vortex mk2 from Selbys, which should arrive by the end of the week. 

On the 2 channel front, I've ordered a new cartridge to replace my ancient Supex ,  am having a phone stage built by a local guy from SNA, and having my Rega RB300 tone arm re-wired. Should be a marked improvement over what I have at the moment. 

great news dave ! congrats on the new set, and the spendors retirement plan comes to light :D 

should be a lovely set if want some help with an audyssey pro cal let me know once speakers run in. i dont do for a living or anything, your just down the road and happy to help out at no charge but the cost of license,

56 minutes ago, IMDave said:

If over time I find myself listening to more and more music, I might start a new thread : " Do you really need a separate power & pre- amp for quality 2 channel , or is an integrated enough?" 😂😂😂

sounds like going fair way with 2ch side particularly wiht the LPs. i would be surprised if a dedicated 2ch pre/pwr(integrated) with ht bypass didnt bring something to proceedings....

haha with the pre pwr/integrated question I can answer that already having had both. there is no black white answer. there are gorgeous 2ch integrated units that are perfectly fine and as good if not better than many pre powers. the difference with the 2ch integrated is power wise e.g. most typically might have same sort of power supply in your marantz so more than sufficient for just 2 channels they have to drive with plenty in reserve. i myself can think of some super integrated units id happily run, but in my setup for config the pre pwr setup is what i need given where my pre is vs pwr to drive the speakers :) 

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Hey Dave, i have had my yamaha HX set of 7.1 speakers for 10 years plus and the only thing i would change on my speakers is the center channel not that its no good but i could do a little better. Now one thing to take into account also for me is that i have the Audyssey pro and love it and it does wonders for my center channel and sub and they are two main components in home theater as a rule.Only you will know what you need to do as your room acoustics are different to someone else's. If you have $2000.00 to spend on a center speaker well that would be a great little investment but i would compare a good few to what you already have even if it means taking your current speaker into the show room to test .I would go that far.

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I viewed a house recently that had a beautiful Stingray valve amp. Beautiful looking piece of kit.

Was hooked up to Mourdant Short speakers and only heard background music while we viewed the property but man it looked sweet.

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Thanks for posting this, I read it with interest as I have had basically the same question floating around my head!

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On 02/08/2017 at 7:58 AM, IMDave said:

Ha,ha sorry guys.Yes, this thread is a bit like Melbourne weather. Changes very quickly.:lol:

So yes, the Spendors are to be retired from my system. ( But be reincarnated in a new HT system I'm setting up for a mate at work. He's getting my old Epson 1080p PJ / Oppo bdp83/ Marantz sr7002/ Spendors & Krix Centrix. Just needs a 2nd hand sub, surrounds and a screen. )

I've ordered the Krix Harmonix mk2 & Vortex mk2 from Selbys, which should arrive by the end of the week. 

On the 2 channel front, I've ordered a new cartridge to replace my ancient Supex ,  am having a phone stage built by a local guy from SNA, and having my Rega RB300 tone arm re-wired. Should be a marked improvement over what I have at the moment. 

If over time I find myself listening to more and more music, I might start a new thread : " Do you really need a separate power & pre- amp for quality 2 channel , or is an integrated enough?" 😂😂😂

For those following at home.......................

The Krix Harmonix mk2 and Vortex mk2 arrived and are breaking in nicely.

Before DTV folds, I thought I'd complete this journey with today's acquisition: Harmon Kardon HK990  2 x 150watts Class A/B dual mono integrated amp.

:wub::o

 

hk990.jpg

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On 8/11/2017 at 6:53 PM, IMDave said:

Harmon Kardon HK990  2 x 150watts Class A/B dual mono integrated amp.

This makes me mad :) only because I never knew about this amp and it looks to have absolutely everything I am looking for, Dac, sub out, ht bypass. Bugger I just bought a Primare i32 and there is one for sale 2nd hand for $990.

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