Win and Go are coming up as just black screens yesterday and today (not "Searching for signal...")... anybody else getting this or is it just me?

Yeah.. I noticed that yesterday. Win, GO and Win-hd were all blank for a period of time, but fixed itself during afternoon... I've just turned on and all are ok.

BTW.. since this heat wave hit I've noticed moderate pixelation on numerous channels.. but not Foxtel.. I'm hoping my aerial is ok.

As part of "rebuilding" their HD channel, it looks as though they changed the PIDS. Fully-compliant devices should be able to cope, with no action required by the user, but devices that are non-compliant in that area will require a rescan or manual PID change.

regarding WIN's "rebuilt" HD service,

is it just me or is there no visible difference in picture quality between their SD and HD programs? I'm sure previously I could see a difference, say in the Today program...

It's just you. Win HD is clearly far crisper and with better colour than Win SD - and that's just on my 1366 x 768 Sony screen. The sound is much better too, particularly via a 5.1 receiver.

I agree that reception has declined a bit during the hot weather. Occasional pixilation, which is normally rare with my set-up and situation.

Is Win HD just 1440 x 1080i, or have they gone the whole hog to 1920 x 1080i?

I read somewhere that the MPEG II standard has room for improvement, such that somewhat better signal compression can be achieved with improvements to the existing software algorithms. And that is not by moving standards to MPEG 4. Does this mean that in the future we can look forward to flawless 1920 x 1080i within the limited bandwiths we have, and with our existing MPEG II equipment?

Rod

You won't see 1920 x 1080 in the space WIN has to play with as MPEG-2.

sound on WIN HD still doesn't seem to be in 5.1

I'm sure it used to be on some movies...months ago

Apparently there have been big improvements in encoding MPEG II SD channels, such that less bandwith is needed to achieve high-quality SD transmissions. This frees up more bandwith for HD channels - legacy STBs notwithstanding. We may yet get to see 1920 x 1080i resolution. May have to wait a while.

See:- Tandberg blurb

While there have been continual improvements in MPEG-2 encoding techniques and image pre-processing over the years, I'd be surprised if WIN delivers 1920 x 1080 as well as two 720 x 576 SD services. If it did happen, I'd expect the picture quality of one or more of the programs to be poor.

Suppose that Go! is currently encoded using one of Tandberg's latest offering. Its parked at around 5.5Mbit/sec with variable length GOPs. Assuming that does not lower further when HD restarts (IMO it will, but who can tell to where) its probably fair to say that when WIN has its new playout facility working fully that the main WIN SD channel using new encoders will be at a similar rate. That leaves ~12Mbit/sec for HD. I can't see 1920 being particularly impressive in that allocation.

WIN may make use of 'stat muxing' which would change the playing field considerably but IMO still wouldn't allow for 1920 with good quality.

Time will tell, of course.

I have previously read that the MPEG 2 standard has an ultimate potential for a 30% reduction in bandwidth required for SD channels, and presumably a similar reduction for HD channels.

To go from 1440 x 1080 to 1920 x 1080 HD resolution represents an increase of 33% in bandwidth -- probably somewhat less when all things are considered. If two SD and one HD channels require 30% less bandwidth, then a an increase in resolution to 1920 x 1080 for the HD channel is eminently possible -- a shoe-in in fact. Even a 20% improvement in overall efficiency should do it with ease.

Give it five of 6 years, and the miserly allocation of bandwidth currently given to the various DTV suppliers may seem very generous indeed!

Rod

Yeah! The new Win HD channel has a resolution of 1440 x 1080, at least in Canberra.

I rescanned for the new channel on my PC, so that i could capture a screen to determine the resolution.

Rod

Always treat figures quoted by vendors, no matter how reputable, with suspicion until proven. In this case assume the minimum figure, 15%. An increase from 1440 to 1920 has 33% more pixels but that does not necessarily equate to 33% more MPEG-2 data.

Currently WIN SD averages ~7Mbit/sec. GO! averages ~5.5Mbit/sec. Assuming Go! encoded with a recent encoder that may well be your 30% in operation right there. Reduce WIN SD to ~5.5 Mbit/sec and you are left with ~12Mbit/sec.

Can 1920 HD 'look good' in a maximum of 12Mbit/sec?
Will WIN SD and GO! have lower bit rates when WIN HD resumes? More than likely, but what is the question.
Will WIN employ 'stat muxing' or will it stay with essentially CBR video? If CBR and HD is to get a reasonable amount of bits (think 14Mbit) it has to come from somewhere and that somewhere will be WIN SD and GO!

A lot of questions, and as before time will tell. Until time does tell all is speculation.

Until WIN has local advertising on WIN HD and its up and running again in all areas I wouldn't be calling it quits just yet as WIN may not have completed the project. IMO, in all likelyhood WIN HD will remain as 1440 as you have found this morning, but you never know...

WIN do use stat muxing and they don't use Tandberg encoders.
I believe their brand of choice is Scientific Atlanta.
STW in Perth used to have 1920 x 1081i on their HD service until WIN took over operations and it deteriorated to what would seem their default HD standard of 1440.

As mentioned earlier it will be interesting to see what happens when the ABC/WIN joint venture playout centre gets up, although given that the ABC only uses 720 x 576p for their HD probably not much change.

You are correct. No 5.1 since the relaunch. Disappointing.

Well someone in Wollongong or Canberra could post a TS and tell us now what they are doing .

Ah yes, they could. But is that the final situation or just an intermediate cobble together to get the all important cricket in HD?

My DGTEC PVR's have been having trouble with WIN and GO! since the recent changes, but only sometimes.

http://www.dtvforum.info/index.php?showtop...t&p=1465629

I still think the picture quality (on my Pioneer 50inch) after Win's HD relaunch , is still not as good as it was a few months ago. eg on Today program.

And it's nowhere as good as Prime's HD, nor ONE HD (on some programs at least!)