Hi All,

I am looking for opinions on a 86cm Widescreen CRT purchase.

Requirements:

- 70% of use will be for NTSC DVD via HTPC source (Progressive).

- 20% of use will be for PAL DVD via HTPC source (Progressive).

- 10% DTV viewing.

1) What progressive scan modes should I consider for this purchase, my findings suggest (480p@60Hz, 576p@50Hz, 720p@60Hz and 1080i@50Hz/60Hz)?

2) Should I disregard 720p@60Hz from the selection process as 1080i@60Hz is superior for NTSC DVD playback?

My own investigation reveals only two 86cm Widescreen CRT TV's match this criteria:


Sony KVHR36M31

Palsonic 86WSHDA


I look forward to any opinions offered.

Regards

Philby

Bumpula?

There are not too many CRT that do both PAL and NTSC.

Probably only RankArena (which are soo hard to locate as RA got gobbled up by Mistral International, who then seem to have gone all quiet)

http://www.ferret.com.au/articles/83/0c010d83.asp

Secondly the new Palsonic 86cm HDTV.

Both use a HD 86cm Toshiba tube. I have the RA which has 13 native video modes and includes all combinations of PAL (576i 576p 720p and 1080i all at 50Hz) and NTSC (480i 480p, 720p and 1080i all at 60Hz) plus 8 learning video modes...total of 21.

The Palsonic also has the similar set of video modes. If you visit the Palsonic website, you can find the user manual for the 86cm HDTV with all the video modes listed in the back. Don't be put off by the name, as we all remember they were a 'cheap' brand, as was Toyota and Honda many years ago.

http://www.palsonic.com.au/product_sales/c.../ctv86wshda.htm


The above two are quite a paradigm shift for consumers as they are both really HD monitors which double as HDTV's

Teamed with a Thomson DTI1500HD using it's Auto-CRT mode, the PQ exceeds all other HDTV's and HD-STB's.....very few people have actually seen how good "Auto-CRT" modes are....

Has anyone seen a non HD 86cm 16:9 TV for sale.
The 76cm models are to damn small and I have no need of HD for watching DVD's or Foxtel Sat.

Owen

Theres this SD interegrated panasonic. At $4179...

http://www.panasonic.com.au/catalogue/deta...CTVIDTV&cat=1_1

HaHaHa ROFL

They must be Mad. $1,400 would be more like it.

A 76cm SD model can be had for about $700 so why would anyone want to spend over $3000 more for an extra 10cm.
Even a HD 86cm can be had for $3500 and that is still outrageous given the small size.


Owen

Don't under estimate what HD can do for your DVD & Foxtel viewing....

DVD (& Foxtel) at best is 576i which is displayed as 288 lines @25Hz and then the alternate 288 lines at 25Hz

An HDTV will upscales this as 576 lines every 50 Hz....you will be very impressed with the step up from 576i to 576p

I have a Hitachi 147cm HD RPTV that is tweaked to the max and driven from a very high spec HTPC at 1920x1080.
I am well aware of what upscaling can do.
I much prefer 1080i to 576p on my big screen, the resolution increase is very noticeable at my viewing distance of 2.8 meters.
An 86cm is such a small screen that I consider anything more then 576 lines pointless, especially for crappy Foxtel.

I was only considering an 86 wide screen to replace an aging 68cm for general family use, and am not prepared to spend $3500 plus just to get the same screen height that the 68cm provides.
Sorry if I sound arrogant, but all I need is a SD wide screen at a sane price.

Regards,

Owen

I have owned both a Panasonic 200A and a Sony KHVR36M31, the Sony is best for PQ.

Hey owen im pretty sure the Panna 86cm IDTV can be had for around the $3K mark these days
Cheers Ryan

I was quoted $2700 for the 86cm Panasonic IDTV today with 5 year warranty. Quite tempting. Anyone heard anything bad about these sets. Can't find much on the Web or in the forums.

Owen,

I have been following your Hitachi exploits with interest.

Can you advise who sells the Hitachi and approximately the price as I haven't found a web site yet with this information and the usual Harvey Norman, Retravision sources don't seem to have any on display?

Also, what tube size is used in this RPTV and what is it's actual resolvability?

I was going to get a used NEC 9PG+ front projector a few years ago for about $1600, but the salesguy sold it out from under me to someone else whilst I was finalising the deal and since then all other CRT options have been too expensive, too small or had technical deficiencies. It would be good to find a reasonably priced, technically excellent option.

Ian

The only Hitachi I have seen on display was at HN at Auburn in Sydney.
I suggest you call Hitachi Australia and ask for a list of retailers.

A 57” model should cost no more then $4500 if you haggle.

Tube size is not quoted, but is almost certainly 7” as are most CRT RPTV’s.
Only the top end 65” – 75” Mitsubishi models in the US have 9” tubs.

Resolution is difficult to measure accurately, but is around 1400x800 resolvable on a white on black test pattern but looks higher due to the total lake of visible pixel structure.
CRT’s have different resolvable resolution at different brightness levels so that a full white on black test pattern will give less resolution then a grey on black pattern or real video image.

With my modifications to use about 10% more of the CRT surface area and remove overscan, I have about 1075 horizontal lines on screen with 5 lines of overscan. There is some blending of lines so resolution is not that high on a normal test patterns but on diagonal lines all 1075 lines are there and can be counted. This makes diagonal lines and curves look very smooth.

Before modifications I had about 980 lines on screen with 20 lines of overscan.

CRT RPTV’s are definitely not the best option for the average punter IMHO, but if you want to put in some time and effort, great results are possible.
The use of a HTPC to provide upscaling to 1920x1080 is highly recommended.
Getting a good clean source is critical for good quality on a large screen, especially if you intend to view from about 3 meters.

Regards,

Owen

Owen,

Thanks for the information.

Which model do you have? I thought you were discussing the 47" unit, but you mention the 57" unit for $4500 in this thread, so I'm not sure which one you have been quoting specs on (or are they essentially the same but with a larger screen and therefore longer optical path and maybe tweaked gun output?).

There are claims of around $3200 for the 47", which makes it somewhat more affordable.

Do you know if the 57" is "better" than the 47"?

Ian

Whats a HTPC?

HTPC=Home Theater PC (Computer)

Sorry Ian, I missed your post.

I have the 57” model.

The 47” and 57” are almost identical internally.

As for which is better, well if you want a larger picture the 57” is better and if you don’t, the 47” is better.

I purchased my 57” Hitachi to replace a Toshiba 43” 4:3 TV, both are viewed from 2.8 meters. I found the 43” 4:3 to be WAY too small. I wanted something HD and twice as big.
The 57” 16:9 model gives me a picture that is only slightly bigger vertically then my old 43”.
A 46” is just too small for my needs.
The 46” would still be good if viewed from about 3meters, but if you are viewing from 4-5meters, a 57” would be much better.

Regards,

Owen

Thats a good price!

only three things with these sets first only scarts on the back the second no progressive scan, third only SD.


other wise a pretty good deal for a integrated set if you are after the convenience.

Thanks for the clarification Owen. My viewing distance is about 2.8m.

I really should have taken these posts to the Hitachi C47-WD5000 thread.

However, the Hitachi is probably not for me after your comment about the shiny screen: I can't fully control illumination and have enough problems with a Grundig 80cm "beachball" ;-)

Nevertheless, will keep Hitachi in mind for the future for build quality and technical excellence.

Ian