8 replies to this topic

[alanh]

ST Microelectronics CD00294403
This chip enables nearly double the data carrying capacity of a TV channel and the MPEG-4 compression makes the video about 1/3 of the data of that from MPEG-2

Sony also has DVB-T2 demodulator chip.

AlanH

Edited by alanh, 12 September 2011 - 09:57 PM.

[digitalj]

1/2 would be more accurate in terms of encoding efficiency compared to MPEG-2. Yes there will be times when MPEG-4 AVC can represent the exact same image with less than 50% of the bitrate used by MPEG-2, but not always.

[DrP]

No no no!  This product simply can't exist.  As alanh has told us all before there simply is no such thing as an integrated demod / decoder device.

[DrP]

While I was fishing around for something else I came across this little gem in reference to single chip integrated demod / decoders.  alanh is attempting to dismiss the device because it doesn't support T2 (note: more than one device, was available at this time but alanh was unable to find them, surprise surprise).  How long did it take for one with T2 support to appear?  Hmm.  Is it possible to have a negative time frame?  

alanh, on Jun 13 2010, 09:05 PM, said:

So you found one with an integrated demodulator That's fine, but how long will it take for them to put the DVB-T2 into that chip. They will not wish to pay for Sony's patent so they will have to design their own.

[andrewlace]

What is the application of this product? Am I missing something?  I know ST makes some of the best ICs on the market, but ....

DrP, on Oct 2 2011, 02:02 PM, said:

While I was fishing around for something else I came across this little gem in reference to single chip integrated demod / decoders.  alanh is attempting to dismiss the device because it doesn't support T2 (note: more than one device, was available at this time but alanh was unable to find them, surprise surprise).  How long did it take for one with T2 support to appear?  Hmm.  Is it possible to have a negative time frame?  

[alanh]

Andrew,
By the end of 2014 all TV channels will be restacked into groups of 6 RF channels per site. They will pick from
A 6 - 8, 10 - 12
B 28 - 33
C 34 - 39
D 40 - 45
E 46 - 51
Vertical or horizontal polarisation will be used.
Channels 9 and 9A have been reserved for 8 DAB+ RF channels.
The only spare channel is 27.

As a result there is no extra channels for either more programs, more HD or even compatible 3-D. The only way to achieve this is to increase the data carrying capability of an RF channel by changing to DVB-T2. Receivers which contain a DVB-T2 demodulator can also receive DVB-T as we use now. This will just about double the data carrying capacity of a single channel. In addition changing compression from MPEG2 - MPEG-4 reduces the data required for a particular picture quality by atleast 30 %

To enable broadcasters to improve their service requires an improvement in receivers. MPEG-4 compression is used by many countries and the number using DVB-T2 is increasing. The UK has already sold a million receivers which are capable of DVB-T2/MPEG4 in less than 12 months. Semiconductor manufacturers do not make MPEG-2 decompressors any more.

The cost of adding DVB-T2/MPEG-4 is insignificant and considerably cheaper than having another rollout of STBs/PVRs. Consider the additional cost of an extra tuner, power supply, case, decompressor, control microprocessor and another remote control.

From a broadcaster point of view, all of the around 500 transmitters will need new DVB-T2 modulators which can switch modes under broadcaster control, and MPEG-4 compressors on each network feed to transmitters.

I do not want another STB rollout which will have considerable viewer scorn if it happens in under 10 years.

If the government had specified back in 2006 that all new receivers had to be able to recieve DVB-T/MPEG2 there would have been far less STBs paid for by viewers, even better if they had followed NZ and specified MPEG-4 decompressor.

It was only when OneHD came on air, the SD only receivers rapidly dissappeared from the shelves of shops.

Forward planning is better than trying to fix it later.

AlanH

[DrP]

andrewlace, on Oct 2 2011, 07:30 PM, said:

What is the application of this product? Am I missing something?  I know ST makes some of the best ICs on the market, but ....

The application is ... <drum roll> ... any STB / PVR!  Do it all digital devices that cover all standards have existed for quite some time despite the denial of their existence by a certain well known forum member.  Its hardly surprising that such devices would exist as it lowers costs to everyone across the board - design houses only have to construct one family of devices.  Foundries only have to implement one family of devices.  Only one family of devices has to be stocked etc etc etc right down the line.  The same thing happened in the analogue world where a typical chip handled all the various analogue formats - add tuner and you are essentially done.

As for alanh's waffle, its really nothing to do with your question rather alanh beating his chest proclaiming his 'superior' knowledge which is fairly typical even if he does contradict himself in the process.  Previously alanh proclaimed that there were no SD receivers for sale, but now it seems that they really were still available!  I wonder what revelations tomorrow will bring.  

Edited by DrP, 03 October 2011 - 06:24 AM.

[alanh]

Stump-100,
The most important thing is to get receivers compatible. Leave transmitters for quite a few years.

AlanH