143 replies to this topic

[XxDeadlyxX]

cuvan, on Jul 11 2011, 10:37 AM, said:

http://hcc.techradar...ainst-2351-06-0

Came across the above article and thought it was quite interesting - similar to the problems we have here when they decide to muck about with the aspect ratio.

Thanks for that article - will definitely be avoiding the UK release of Ironclad, the US version of Ironclad comes out on Jul 26th and hopefully it's OAR.

Anything that has a specifically different transfer for UK should not be automatically trusted - such as these Warner examples where it's not a copy of the US transfer. Another studio doing this is Lionsgate UK - they have cropped many of their releases and done other stupid things like having only Dolby Digital 5.1 etc.... whereas the main US branch of Lionsgate never do those things.

[Quark]

Cropped releases have become the norm in the UK - I no longer use Amazon UK for movies for that reason.

[MSB]

This is a great example of where the region coding scheme is broken.

If you live in the US, you may see the movie the way it was actually made. If you live in the UK or Australia,  here's a destroyed version.

Yeah, that makes sense.

[athlon]

One more title for the cropped list.

"And when did you last see your father" released by Icon.

[XxDeadlyxX]

athlon, on Aug 17 2011, 09:30 PM, said:

One more title for the cropped list.

"And when did you last see your father" released by Icon.

Thanks, added.

Haven't been to my local video store for a while to borrow some new releases by culprit studios (Roadshow etc), does anyone know if the local versions of any of these are cropped or not:

Beastly
The Warrior's Way (Sony/Hoyts... suspicious - UK is 2.35:1)
Limitless
The Way Back
The Lincoln Lawyer
Lord of the Dance

[XxDeadlyxX]

Update: New Addition:

Bran Nue Dae (Roadshow) - US version is OAR

There is a US version coming out next month luckily - and it's from 20th Century Fox. Will they release it OAR? Yes I think so They don't do crap like cropping.

[MarkTecher]

So are the "crops" a straight centre cut or are they panning and scanning too?

[XxDeadlyxX]

MarkTecher, on Aug 24 2011, 11:48 AM, said:

So are the "crops" a straight centre cut or are they panning and scanning too?

Most comparison shots I have looked at from the cropped to the OAR seem to be centre cut... but check out this link about a UK disc - it is pan and scan.

On some discs it even varies from scene to scene - and for example with 22 Bullets UK and AU versions, 95% of the film is cropped, and the other 5% is actually open matte    - someone told me that on another forum, whoever mastered that disc clearly has no clue....

and even WORSE is Strange Bedfellows and Buried (both by Icon), which start off as 2.35:1 but change to cropped a few minutes in.... that is beyond stupid. It's like it changes to OMG IMAX mode for the rest of the movie!

(but without the WOW factor   )

...and crappier PQ too - you can really tell it's 'zoomed'.

Edited by XxDeadlyxX, 24 August 2011 - 04:58 PM.

[groovem]

XxDeadlyxX, on Aug 23 2011, 10:15 PM, said:

Update: New Addition:

Bran Nue Dae (Roadshow) - US version is OAR

There is a US version coming out next month luckily - and it's from 20th Century Fox. Will they release it OAR? Yes I think so They don't do crap like cropping.

IMO the Australian release of Bran-Nue-Dae is the worst I have ever seen. The cropping is very obvious with the big dance numbers - you can see that there are dancers missing on the sides, and in the scenes with Missy Higgins the lip sync is way out.

[XxDeadlyxX]

groovem, on Aug 24 2011, 06:00 PM, said:

IMO the Australian release of Bran-Nue-Dae is the worst I have ever seen. The cropping is very obvious with the big dance numbers - you can see that there are dancers missing on the sides, and in the scenes with Missy Higgins the lip sync is way out.

Yeh I just simply refuse to watch releases like this - unless it's rare cases like Ten Canoes where it's a really great film and not available anywhere else on Blu....

A real shame about Bran Nue Dae... Andrew Lesnie's photography getting butchered   And a pain having to import from somewhere else but at least it's an option.

[MarkTecher]

XxDeadlyxX, on Aug 24 2011, 04:54 PM, said:

...and crappier PQ too - you can really tell it's 'zoomed'.

Sad to hear that.  Because if I scale a 1.85:1 or true 16:9 for CIH, the quality does not drop off to the point where I can tell this is scaled.  The tell tale is the framing where heads are getting clipped off or the shot just looks too crammed.  Open mat format should technically work, but when they have taken the centre 1440 x 810 and blown that out to fill the 1920 x 1080 frame then it will already look bad and any additional Scaling is just going to look poor.  I was interested in a few titles on the list too.  Looks as if they will go on the "watch much later" list now.

[athlon]

XxDeadlyxX, on Aug 17 2011, 10:14 PM, said:

Beastly
The Warrior's Way (Sony/Hoyts... suspicious - UK is 2.35:1)
Limitless
The Way Back
The Lincoln Lawyer
Lord of the Dance

Beastly is OAR and The Warrior's Way is 1.78:1 but appears to be open matte.

I have also watched The Blair Witch Project released by Icon and it has been cropped from 1.33:1 to 1.78:1 (top and bottom chopped off).

[XxDeadlyxX]

athlon, on Aug 31 2011, 08:52 PM, said:

Beastly is OAR and The Warrior's Way is 1.78:1 but appears to be open matte.

I have also watched The Blair Witch Project released by Icon and it has been cropped from 1.33:1 to 1.78:1 (top and bottom chopped off).

Thanks for that info, both added.

[XxDeadlyxX]

Update: New Addition:

The Ward (Roadshow) - open matte - US version is OAR

EDIT: Actually removed this one since I just leaned it actually hasn't been released here (I have a test disc of it). Word is that Roadshow are actually going to release a corrected 2.35:1 release of this. The same thing happened in the UK (Warner Brothers). This is because John Carpenter complained that the release was open matte and wanted it OAR. Good to know it's happening here too. But no release date as of yet.

Edited by XxDeadlyxX, 01 September 2011 - 09:47 PM.

[judge25]

Maybe this topic should be pinned (sticky). It certainly is an excellent and unfortunately growing resource  
Not sure how one goes about this, admins?

[XxDeadlyxX]

judge25, on Sep 1 2011, 08:35 PM, said:

Maybe this topic should be pinned (sticky). It certainly is an excellent and unfortunately growing resource  
Not sure how one goes about this, admins?

Yep - Ask and you shall receive  

And yep there are definitely more to be added that I know of - Arn The Knight Templar and The Maiden Heist are both 1.78:1 - just need to confirm whether they are cropped or open matte - need to compare to the US releases etc first.

Edited by XxDeadlyxX, 02 September 2011 - 10:26 AM.

[XxDeadlyxX]

Update: New Addition - confirmed this one as cropped:

The Maiden Heist (AI Entertainment/Pinnacle) - Canada version is OAR

[cuvan]

XxDeadlyxX, on Sep 2 2011, 10:22 AM, said:

And yep there are definitely more to be added that I know of - Arn The Knight Templar and The Maiden Heist are both 1.78:1 - just need to confirm whether they are cropped or open matte - need to compare to the US releases etc first.

Arn: The Knight Templar (Collectors Edition)

I picked it up in the JBHiFi 2 for $30 sale. I haven't watched it all the way through yet, but this is what I've noticed so far --

1) The film itself is split in two parts, so I assume this is the original two films released in Sweden a few years back, perhaps with some additional editing.

2) Audio:
DTS-HD Master Audio
Dolby Digital TrueHD
Dolby Digital 5.1

3) It says Region B on the cover, but it plays fine on my Region A Oppo.

4) Aspect Ratio - as stated above, the picture is 1.78:1. I don't have the OAR American disc for comparison, but I was able to freeze a scene and compare it to this screenshot over on Blu-ray.com and this is what I noticed: if you look at the screenshot, almost 25% of the picture to the left of the figures has been removed and another 10-15% of ground beneath them has been added. In this scene at least, no sky appears to have been added or taken away. Basically, they've cropped some parts of the image and added other bits in order to make it 1.78:1. They don't appear to have blown up the image to fit the screen, at least as far as I could tell.
So, can anyone with a better understanding of these matters explain exactly what this means as regards cropping and open matte?

[XxDeadlyxX]

cuvan, on Sep 7 2011, 05:59 PM, said:

Arn: The Knight Templar (Collectors Edition)

I picked it up in the JBHiFi 2 for $30 sale. I haven't watched it all the way through yet, but this is what I've noticed so far --

1) The film itself is split in two parts, so I assume this is the original two films released in Sweden a few years back, perhaps with some additional editing.

2) Audio:
DTS-HD Master Audio
Dolby Digital TrueHD
Dolby Digital 5.1

3) It says Region B on the cover, but it plays fine on my Region A Oppo.

4) Aspect Ratio - as stated above, the picture is 1.78:1. I don't have the OAR American disc for comparison, but I was able to freeze a scene and compare it to this screenshot over on Blu-ray.com and this is what I noticed: if you look at the screenshot, almost 25% of the picture to the left of the figures has been removed and another 10-15% of ground beneath them has been added. In this scene at least, no sky appears to have been added or taken away. Basically, they've cropped some parts of the image and added other bits in order to make it 1.78:1. They don't appear to have blown up the image to fit the screen, at least as far as I could tell.
So, can anyone with a better understanding of these matters explain exactly what this means as regards cropping and open matte?

Thanks for the info - yeh that means it falls into the category of 'reframing'. Added it to the list.

Arn: The Knight Templar (Eagle) - reframing - US version is OAR - This includes both the Australian regular and Collector's editions

Would have been good if there was somewhere we could get both films in OAR, but i think I might just make do with watching my US version rather than get the AU collector's version.

Edited by XxDeadlyxX, 07 September 2011 - 07:41 PM.

[cuvan]

XxDeadlyxX, on Sep 7 2011, 07:39 PM, said:

Thanks for the info - yeh that means it falls into the category of 'reframing'. Added it to the list.

Arn: The Knight Templar (Eagle) - reframing - US version is OAR - This includes both the Australian regular and Collector's editions

Would have been good if there was somewhere we could get both films in OAR, but i think I might just make do with watching my US version rather than get the AU collector's version.

Just to rub our faces in it, the two-part making of documentary features many scenes presented in the OAR, and it looks great. Even more frustrating, many of the scenes shown are not even in the longer Collectors Edition cut, but are from the original full length Swedish version.

[john-andrew]

XxDeadlyxX, on Mar 6 2011, 04:07 PM, said:

And yeh the US versions are the best in almost all cases, in fact I don't think I've seen a US release that's cropped.

Well, most of my bluray titles are from the US and thanks for telling.

XxDeadlyxX, on Mar 6 2011, 04:07 PM, said:

AU must be the worst place to be anywhere in the world for dodgy releases   Except Alliance Canada, some of their releases are just as bad.

I've noticed 'Alliance Canada' is no good either. Well, they aren't OAR, not captioned for the deaf and most are locked on 'A'.

Well, the title of 'Seven' was one of them, to get rid of that for a US release and much better.

XxDeadlyxX, on Jun 2 2011, 11:07 PM, said:

1080i50 hey? Wow Roadshow are sure putting out some random discs.... I don't see why anyone would want the AU version of that, compared to the excellent US version with 1080p and DTS MA 7.1. (AU is 5.1).

I wouldn't either and just as well, a US version of 'The Next Three Days' is good to have.

Edited by john-andrew, 15 September 2011 - 01:58 PM.

[XxDeadlyxX]

john-andrew, on Sep 15 2011, 01:52 PM, said:

I've noticed 'Alliance Canada' is no good either. Well, they aren't OAR, not captioned for the deaf and most are locked on 'A'.

Well, the title of 'Seven' was one of them, to get rid of that for a US release and much better.

Yeh I have a few titles from them - one being 'A Man Apart' (Vin Diesel) - had to import it from Canada as it isn't released anywhere else - it's open matte luckily though not cropped.

Canada release of Blade 1 is cropped - so I imported the dutch version which is OAR, but got the canada versions of Blade 2 and 3 which are OAR

[athlon]

Another one from Pinnacle Films which is open matte is The Reef, US edition is OAR.

[XxDeadlyxX]

athlon, on Sep 21 2011, 06:44 PM, said:

Another one from Pinnacle Films which is open matte is The Reef, US edition is OAR.

Thanks for the info - added. Yeh was looking around for this one but hadn't borrowed it yet - will now get the US version instead  

[XxDeadlyxX]

Just a warning - I borrowed Pathfinders: In the Company of Strangers (Eagle Entertainment) not long ago to check if it is OAR - and it is. But the PQ on this title is possibly one of the worst Blu-rays ever!! It looks like it was shot on SD video or something - even though it was shot on super 35. It is extremely soft and there is no detail hardly at all. I've seen DVD's that look better. I wonder if the French import is better....