Definitive list of networks and PIDs, Info to configure DVB-T software. Options

[peteru]

It seems that not all software is capable of correctly indetifying PIDs in a stream.



I'd like to request that people post a list of the PIDs that they have verified to work correctly. To start, here are some values to tune to individual networks:

CODE

Common to all Australian DVB-T:
Bandwidth: 7MHz
      QAM: 64
     Mode: 8kHz
Hierarchy: NONE
Inversion: OFF

CODE

SYDNEY
Network   Channel   Freq.(MHz)   FEC   Guard
-------   -------   ----------   ---   -----
ABC       VHF 12    226.5        3/4   1/16
Seven     VHF  6    177.5        2/3   1/8
Nine      VHF  8    191.625      3/4   1/16
Ten       VHF 11    219.5        3/4   1/16
SBS       UHF 34    571.5        2/3   1/8

And the PIDs I have so far (not all have been verified to work correctly):

CODE

SYDNEY
Name            Service ID   PCR-PID   PMT-PID   Video-PID   Audio-PID   Teletext-PID   AC3-PID
--------------  -----------  --------  --------  ----------  ----------  ------------   -------
NINE DIGITAL    1            135       256       519         720         583            0
NINE HD         5            128       260       512         0           583            650
NINE GUIDE      6            133       261       517         720         583            0
ABC HDTV        544          128       258       512         0           576            2308
ABC TV Sydney   545          128       256       512         650         576            660
ABC TV 2        546          128       257       512         650         576            0
ABC TV 3        547          128       259       512         650         576            0
ABC TV 4        548          2306      260       2307        2308        2310           0
ABC DiG Radio   550          2305      261       0           2311        0              0
SBS HD          768          102       1024      102         103         0              0
SBS DIGITAL 1   769          161       1025      161         81          41             0
SBS DIGITAL 2   770          162       1026      162         83          42             0
SBS EPG         772          163       1032      163         85          43             0
SBS RADIO 1     782          201       1027      0           201         0              0
SBS RADIO 2     783          202       1028      0           202         0              0
7 Digital       1312         513       512       513         514         516            0
7 Digital 1     1313         513       528       513         514         516            0
7 Digital 2     1314         513       544       513         514         516            0
7 Digital 3     1315         513       560       513         514         516            0
7 HD Digital    1316         577       576       577         578         516            0
Seven EPG       1318         609       608       609         610         0              0
TEN Digital     1569         128       257       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 1   1570         128       258       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 2   1571         128       259       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 3   1572         128       260       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital     1573         128       256       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 4   1574         128       261       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital     1575         128       262       512         650         576            651
TEN HD          1576         130       263       514         0           576            672
Ten Digital     1577         128       264       512         650         576            651

I'd like to ask others to contribute to this list with data for other regions and submit corrections and comments.

Cheers,

Peter.

This post has been edited by peteru: Sep 21 2003, 06:00 PM

[rns]

Is there a similar list available for Melbourne (many of the values may be the same).
I'm particularly interested in obtaining the ``service-id''s as this information does not
seem to be widely published.

Does someone have the service ids or know where they can be found?

Thanks!

Robert.

[javelin]

peteru,
Name Service ID PCR-PID PMT-PID Video-PID Audio-PID Teletext-PID
-------------- ----------- -------- -------- ---------- ---------- ------------
NINE HD 5 128 260 512 750 583

audio pid for nine hd i think is 750, i was told this and havent actually had a chance to sit down and confirm this but my source is reliable

[peteru]

I have not had much luck with APID 750 for NINE HD during my quick test.

[peteru]

I have done some more work on getting the PIDs sorted. While at it, I also added information on AC3 PIDs and updated a few entries.

Most of these entries have now been verified to work OK, but if anyone has corrections or information about other areas in Australia, feel free to contribute.

[Winston]

Knights Hill (Illawarra/Wollongong NSW)

Network: WIN Digital (585.5 MHz)
--WIN TV Illawarra
APID: 36
VPID: 33
PMT: 32
PCR: 33
Teletext:47

Network: SCB - Ten (592.5 MHz)
--SC10 Wollongong
APID: 386
VPID: 385
PMT: 384
PCR: 385
Teletext: 387

Network: PRIME (599.5 MHz)
--PRIME Wollongong
APID: 2701
VPID: 2700
PMT: 270
PCR: 2700
Teletext: 2705

Network: ABC (690.5 MHz)
--ABC TV NSW
APID: 650
AC3: 660
VPID: 512
PMT: 256
PCR: 128
Teletext: 576

--ABC TV 4
APID: 650
VPID: 512

Network: SBS
I've never been able to lock on SBS Illawarra here at Hurstville in Sydney, dunno why though.

[dcallan]

CODE

[my details]
CARD    =  Nebula (running under Linux 2.6.0-test11)
LOCATION = Brisbane

Here are the results for Brisbane, using "scan" (from linux DVB):

CODE

BRISBANE
Network   Channel   Freq.(MHz)  ?FEC?  ?Guard?
-------   -------   ----------   ---   -----
ABC       VHF 12    226.5        3/4   1/16
Seven     VHF  6    177.5        3/4   1/16
Nine      VHF  8    191.625      3/4   1/16
Ten       VHF 11    219.5        3/4   1/16
SBS       UHF 36    585.625      2/3   1/8

* These FEC and Guard settings are _assumed_ not scanned!

BRISBANE
Name            Service ID   PCR-PID   PMT-PID   Video-PID   Audio-PID   Teletext-PID   AC3-PID
--------------  -----------  --------  --------  ----------  ----------  ------------   -------
ABC HDTV        576          2306      258       2307        0           2309           2308
ABC TV Brisbane 577          128       256       512         650         576            660
ABC TV 2        578          128       257       512         650         576            0
ABC TV 3        579          128       259       512         650         576            0
ABC TV 4        580          128       260       512         650         576            0
ABC DiG Radio   582          2305      261       0           2310        0              0
Nine Digital    1025         130       256       513         660         577            0
Nine Guide      1030         135       257       517         660         577            0
Nine HD         1152         128       261       512         0           576            651
7 Digital       1344          V        1024      1025        1026        1028           0
7 Digital 1     1345          V        32        1025        1026        1028           0
7 Digital 2     1346          V        1056      1025        1026        1028           0
7 Digital 3     1347          V        1072      1025        1026        1028           0
7 HD Digital    1348          V        1088      1089        1090        1028           1091
TEN Digital     1601         128       258       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 1   1602         128       259       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 2   1603         128       260       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 3   1604         128       261       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital     1605         128       257       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital 4   1606         128       256       512         650         576            651
TEN Digital     1607         128       262       512         650         576            651
TEN HD          1608         130       263       514         0           576            672
Ten Digital     1609         128       264       512         650         576            651
SBS HD          816           V        1024      102         103         0              0
SBS DIGITAL 1   817           V        1025      161         81          41             0
SBS DIGITAL 2   818           V        1026      162         83          42             0
SBS EPG         819           V        1032      163         85          43             0
SBS RADIO 1     830           A        1027      0           201         0              0
SBS RADIO 2     831           A        1028      0           202         0              0

Does anyone know how I can identify/verify the FEC and Guard settings for
these channels? I am still testing but some seem to work on 2_3 AND 3_4 for FEC (likewise 1/8 AND 1/16 for Guard).

Please correct any of this if it is wrong!
I had to convert most/all of it from HEX along the way (at a time when I should have been asleep).

Cheers,
-Dan

***NEW*** (edit - 20040127)
- Added SBS channel info for Brisbane (thanks to jasonwea for the correct freq)

This post has been edited by dcallan: Jan 27 2004, 02:39 PM

[kanga202]

Ok what the hell does this all mean whats a PID and how do i add these channels to my avermedia DVB-T??

Please help :ph34r:

[dcallan]

Ok what the hell does this all mean whats a PID and how do i add these channels to my avermedia DVB-T??

Please help

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
I feel your pain. I was just as confused a week ago (and for the 3 months prior that I spent on/off trying to get our Nebula card working under Linux) until I finally got the card working so I could try and record some streams.
Unfortunately, I have not tried the Avermedia card yet so I may not have all the details _you_ need to get going.

Are you using Linux OR just trying to make your card work in Windows?

Frankly, I have not seen anywhere in Windows that needs you to know any of these values (at least not with the DigiTV software we have).
BUT
They are essential to most/all of the Linux DVB apps that are out there!

<<<< WARNING: Everthing below here is for the Linux users >>>>

Once you can actually point "dvbstream" at a frequency (to record a particular channel of DVB tv) you will discover that even if ...
(-a-) your card is working (ie: you don't get "no such DVB Frontend device" error) AND
(-b-) you have the right frequency for that channel
... you may still find that cannot get any Video or Audio streams locked.

This is because on each Channel's frequency, they use PID numbers to identify what the different streams are:
- PID for Video
- PID for Audio (stereo)
- PID for TeleText
- PID for AC3 (Surround Audio)

Unless you are messing with the HD channels, you don't need to worry about the AC3 audio and the TeleText can wait till later too.

Which leaves the two important PIDs: Video-PID (or VPID) and Audio-PID (or APID)

Then, once you know the right A/V PIDs for a channel, you can exec a command to "dvbstream" (in Brisbane) such as:

CODE

dvbstream -qam 64 -cr 3_4 -gi 16 -bw 7 -tm 8 -f 177500 -ps -n 10 -o 1025 1026 > /tmp/test7.mpg

This will record 10 seconds of "Seven Digital" to the file "test7.mpg"
You can see the two PIDs there at the end of the command (ie: V=1025 A=1026) and the frequency for Seven (ie: F=177500). The rest of the parameters are pretty much standard settings for Aust. DVB. The "-n 10" specifies the 10 second duration of the stream dump.

When I fire off that command, the sign that dvbstream actually found some A/V streams to record is in the output:

CODE

dvbstream v0.4pre3 - (C) Dave Chapman 2001
Released under the GPL.
Latest version available from http://www.linuxstb.org/
Using DVB card "NxtWave NXT6000"
tuning DVB-T (in Australia) to 177500000 Hz
polling....
Getting frontend event
FE_STATUS: FE_HAS_SIGNAL FE_HAS_LOCK FE_HAS_CARRIER FE_HAS_VITERBI FE_HAS_SYNC
Event:  Frequency: 188100000
       SymbolRate: 1
       FEC_inner:  3

Bit error rate: 0
Signal strength: 0
SNR: 0
FE_STATUS: FE_HAS_SIGNAL FE_HAS_LOCK FE_HAS_CARRIER FE_HAS_VITERBI FE_HAS_SYNC
Output to stdout
Streaming 2 streams
Audiostream: Layer: 2  BRate: 256 kb/s  Freq: 48.0 kHz
Videostream: ASPECT: 16:9  Size = 720x576  FRate: 25 fps  BRate: 15.00 Mbit/s

Check the bit at the bottom:

CODE

Streaming 2 streams
Audiostream: Layer: 2  BRate: 256 kb/s  Freq: 48.0 kHz
Videostream: ASPECT: 16:9  Size = 720x576  FRate: 25 fps  BRate: 15.00 Mbit/s

Those bits will be missing if you got the PIDs wrong (and you will be recording nothing), but everything else will be there because it still locked onto that frequency properly.

At first, the only stations I could record were ABC and TEN (because they used the 'default' PIDs of V=512 & A=650). I searched everywhere to find the PIDs for the other stations (in Brisbane) and the best I could find was Peter's list for Sydney (see earlier post on this thread). The DBA site only tells you the base frequencies for channels in your area.

So I sat down the other night and worked out how to use the scanning tools that come with Linux DVB to scan these frequencies for what streams were available. The output from these tools was uglier than hell (and in Hexidecimal too) so I converted them to Decimal and used Peter's table as a template to list them all out. I still need to write some scripts to simplify my tuning and recording but with this table, I can now record all 4 stations (SBS is an issue for me, but that is a longer story than this)

Hopefully it will save some people the hassles I went through trying to work this stuff out by myself (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

Cheers,
-Dan

<<<<<<<< EXTRA BITS >>>>>>>>>>

A couple of people have asked me about the dvbtune/dvbstream version I am using (specifically about having the "Australia" setting instead of the default "UK"). My bad ;-) I should have mentioned that I added this mode to the "dvb_defaults.h" which both of them were compiled with. Anyway, here is a patch for adding that mode and making it the default:

dvbtune_defs-au.patch

CODE

--- dvb_defaults.h.orig    2004-01-20 10:14:51.898227192 +1000
+++ dvb_defaults.h    2003-12-17 19:49:15.000000000 +1000
@@ -41,12 +41,26 @@
   make FINLAND=1
*/

+#define AUSTRALIA
//#define UK
//#define FINLAND
//#define FINLAND2

/* UK defines are at the end, as a default option */

+#ifdef AUSTRALIA
+
+/* AUSTRALIA settings */
+#define DVB_T_LOCATION                 "Australia"
+#define BANDWIDTH_DEFAULT              BANDWIDTH_7_MHZ
+#define HP_CODERATE_DEFAULT            FEC_3_4
+#define CONSTELLATION_DEFAULT          QAM_64
+#define TRANSMISSION_MODE_DEFAULT      TRANSMISSION_MODE_8K
+#define GUARD_INTERVAL_DEFAULT         GUARD_INTERVAL_1_16
+#define HIERARCHY_DEFAULT              HIERARCHY_NONE
+
+#endif
+
#ifdef FINLAND

/* FINLAND settings 1 */

Just copy this patch file into same dir as your "dvb_defaults.h" and run:

CODE

patch -p0 < dvb_defs-au.patch

Then you just need to recompile dvbtune (or dvbstream) with:

CODE

make clean && make

NOTE: None of this is _really_ essential since you can override any of these parameters at the command line for dvbtune/dvbstream.

>>>>>>>NEW>>>>>>>>
(08/02/2004)
I have finally written that HOWTO for the Nebula on Linux 2.6.

This post has been edited by dcallan: Feb 8 2004, 10:30 PM

[kanga202]

Wow thanks man, that?s a great tut, I?m sure it will help a lot of people out there someone should make this sticky, as for me though, yes just trying to get it to work in windows, I have to say this is one the wort apps (Avermedia app) I have ever seen, for anything, what were they thinking when they released this crap, I sent them an email telling them how crap there software is and demanding that they put more effort into there gear, but who knows *sigh*they are so lucky there in Taiwan, or I would report them to the ACCC.

[Anarchi]

Anyone here tried running the Nebula card under KNOPPIX Linux?

btw, KNOPPIX is a German Linux distro that runs completely of the CD - no installation (or HardDisk) required at all. The bootable CD is bundled with the new Atomic magazine.

I dont have my Nebula yet so I couldnt test it, but I noticed the Nebula DVB-T was supported in the tvtuner linux app (righ at the bottom of the hardware selection list)...

[Anarchi]

Wow thanks man, that?s a great tut, I?m sure it will help a lot of people out there someone should make this sticky, as for me though, yes just trying to get it to work in windows, I have to say this is one the wort apps (Avermedia app) I have ever seen, for anything, what were they thinking when they released this crap, I sent them an email telling them how crap there software is and demanding that they put more effort into there gear, but who knows *sigh*they are so lucky there in Taiwan, or I would report them to the ACCC.

Lol I know how you feel. AverMedia should put a warning sticker on the box saying "Warning! May cause mental breakdown due to excessively poor software design and lack of HDTV" (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wacko.gif)

Return it and get a Nebula DigiTV ($298) if you can...

[rumpole]

I searched everywhere to find the PIDs for the other stations (in Brisbane)

Once you have 'lock' on a frequency you can run 'scan -c' to give a list of all the PIDS on that frequency. For any particluar area, you get the available frequencies from the DBA site where they are listed against the transmitter that you intend to try and receive from.

The other alternative that I used was just to 'steal' the info from my windows app !!

[dcallan]

Anyone here tried running the Nebula card under KNOPPIX Linux?

I have used Knoppix before ... but haven't tried Knoppix with this card yet.

For the Nebula you need to do a lot of custom kernel stuff that Knoppix would not have by default (I am assuming). I will, however, test this out at my next convenience so I can let you know for sure.

I dont have my Nebula yet so I couldnt test it, but I noticed the Nebula DVB-T was supported in the tvtuner linux app (righ at the bottom of the hardware selection list)...

Really? Because I have tried many different combinatrions of kernels, modules, DVB kits, etc ... and finally got it working with:
Distro = Fedora Linux
Kernel = 2.6.0-test11
DVB = "dvb-kernel" from DVB CVS

And even then it wouldn't work until I stopped trying to use other peoples module-startup scripts and simply started the card with:

CODE

modprobe nxt6000 && modprobe dvb-bt8xx

The reason for using Fedora?
- None really. Most other Nebula DVB'ers who have used 2.6 kernel seem to be using Gentoo linux. Fedora had the newer modutils (req'd for 2.6) stuff built into it already and let me use RPMs for a lot of other packages that I will need to run WebVCR+.

The reason for a 2.6 kernel?
- Because then all the V4L support is already version2 (no V4L hacks)
- And the BT878 support works (no "bytesex.org" bttv hacks)

There is a little more to it than that (eg: the NXT6000 stuff with 2.6 is slightly broken and needs some tiny patches, etc) but I will write up a decent "Nebula_on_2.6" HOWTO for all that and post it somewhere more appropriate than this thread. If anyone needs any help before then, just email me.

Cheers,
-Dan

[dcallan]

Once you have 'lock' on a frequency you can run 'scan -c' to give a list of all the PIDS on that frequency. For any particluar area, you get the available frequencies from the DBA site where they are listed against the transmitter that you intend to try and receive from.

Umm ... did you read the start of my other post? ;-)
That is EXACTLY what I did.

Here are the results for Brisbane, using "scan" (from linux DVB):

- I looked up frequencies here on DBA
- then locked each of them with "dvbtune"
- after dvbtuning each one I ran "scan -v -c" to output the info (in ugly Hex) for that frequency
- then I made a pretty table with Decimal numbers

I wasn't very descriptive about these steps in that post because my main point was to upload the Brisbane DVB List for all people who were just looking for a pre-baked table (like I was) that they could use to lookup the PIDs with.
When I said that I "looked everywhere" I was talking about the WWW.

PS: I couldn't find this info anywhere in my Windows app (DigiTV).

Cheers,
-Dan

[Anarchi]

Ok thanks for that, ill look out for the HOW-TO in the future - in the mean time ill stick with XP.

Since Knoppix is German, and being that Germans are huge DVB-T supporters, I would imagine the Nebula would be pre-configured.

Im getting my Nebula after work today so ill try it tonite.

[rumpole]

HaHa ! The post wasn't to tell you what you already knew, just spelling out the process for anyone else looking to track down the same info for an area not already listed here.

Some (maybe all ?) of the windows apps apparently store the channel details in the registry. My paticular app shows it in the normal interface.

[dcallan]

HaHa ! The post wasn't to tell you what you already knew, just spelling out the process for anyone else looking to track down the same info for an area not already listed here.

lol
OK, sorry for being touchy about it. You're right that it should be spelled out a little clearer than it is in most of the forums. The people on the linuxtv / DVB lists sometimes sound like they are talking in code (actually a lot of the time they are ;-).

Some (maybe all ?) of the windows apps apparently store the channel details in the registry.

Yeah, I have since realised that bit about the registry. It would have been good if I had worked that out earlier but no matter now.

Any ideas as to where I can "scan" the FEC and Guard settings from?
(not that I have any clue what they do exactly ;-)

Cheers,
-Dan

[rumpole]

From reading the theory about it all, they seem to be crucial in the scheme of things but I've never noticed that what I put in those settings makes any difference !!

Different people seem to recommend different settings for the same channels and areas. I don't know where you can get the setting that is applicable to each transmission, either by getting it out of the streams themselves or from an 'official' site. Because it seems to make little difference in practice I haven't put a great deal of effort into finding out I must admit.

[dcallan]

Same here. I have tried several channels with FEC 2_3 vs 3_4 and Guard of 1/8 vs 1/6. It never made any difference at all. <shrug>