169 replies to this topic

[Ramegabyte]

Hi All - I'm afraid I'm a bit of a newbie at all of this stuff - here's my question however:

I have just purchased a new antenna for my TV set it is a Digi-Match 01MM-DG27 compound antenna purchased from Jaycar in Rockhampton.

I have good reception on WIN TV and it's derivatives, ABC & etc & Ten Network.  Reception on SBS is mostly ok - just (very) occasional pixellation.

However I get absolutely ZERO reception from 7 Network.

My Samsung TV doesn't see anything, but my Sony DVD player/recorder sees that 7 is there but cannot display a picture.

I live approx 50 K south of the Mt Hopeful transmitter, with a large hill between me and the tower.  I can't figure why I get good images on the other Channels, but nothing on 7.

I do have a masthead amp - but get nothing if this is switched off.

Anyone have any thoughts?

Thanks.

[newtaste]

Alan, that transmitter list assumes that ALL remote Queensland towns will have to have satellite television. On what facts do you base this? My understanding is that the analogue transmitters owned by the television stations will be converted - the Cooktown and Mt Isa transmitters are owned by Imparja and Southern Cross.

[alanh]

Newtaste,
Imparja/Southern Cross are yet to publically commit to this. What is your source?

Imparja's digital plans
There is no mention of which sites they will actually convert. Many of the sites in my list have populations of less than 500 which was listed in a DBCDE enquiry years ago.

Southern Cross Television. They only admit to transmitters in Alice Springs, Mt Isa and Roma.

They do not have to install transmitters until 2013.
The current list of broadcaster conversions

When the DBCDE. ACMA or the broadcasters list the sites I will modify my list.

AlanH

[alanh]

Ramegabyte,
Fistly to the first post in this strand and click on the transmitter list to see if there is any closer transmitter to you.
From Mt Hopeful, ABC and WIN are both on band 3 VHF which is why it is strong.

SBS 37 7Qld 38 TEN 36. The antenna you have bought is not very sensitive to these channels. If you have a blocked path, you will be better off buying an antenna in the H4+ link in the first post in this strand. It needs to be connected to the existing antenna using the U input to the amplifier and the V input to your existing antenna.

If the amplifer is off no signal will pass through it.

AlanH

[DX Fan]

Ramegabyte, on Aug 24 2010, 03:07 PM, said:

Hi All - I'm afraid I'm a bit of a newbie at all of this stuff - here's my question however:

I have just purchased a new antenna for my TV set it is a Digi-Match 01MM-DG27 compound antenna purchased from Jaycar in Rockhampton.

I have good reception on WIN TV and it's derivatives, ABC & etc & Ten Network.  Reception on SBS is mostly ok - just (very) occasional pixellation.

However I get absolutely ZERO reception from 7 Network.

My Samsung TV doesn't see anything, but my Sony DVD player/recorder sees that 7 is there but cannot display a picture.

I live approx 50 K south of the Mt Hopeful transmitter, with a large hill between me and the tower.  I can't figure why I get good images on the other Channels, but nothing on 7.

I do have a masthead amp - but get nothing if this is switched off.

Anyone have any thoughts?

Thanks.

Hi
The antenna you listed is designed to receive lots of channels but will not necessarily pick up all channels equally even if they are the same strength. It sounds like you are just on the edge of adequate reception with that antenna and its position and height.

How does your antenna (height, direction and size) compare to neighbors? How is their reception?

Common solutions - get your antenna higher or exchange the antenna for a better one.

[alanh]

DX fan,
Phased arrays are only available in channels 21 - 82.  
Only Yagi-Udas are available for restricted channel ranges.

As a DX fan you should be a fan of phased arrays for horizontally polarised signals and Yagi-Udas on their side for vertically polarised signals all in blocked paths. and with distance all paths are blocked by the curvature of the earth.

Yes, antenna height and position can affect the outcome.

The antenna Ramegabyte has bought is designed for band 3 - 5. Element for element the UHF section will have lower gain than one designed for band 4+. eg 01mm-DG21

Ramegabyte,
Jaycar CAT. NO. LT3138 phased array

AlanH

[newtaste]

alanh, on Aug 24 2010, 08:45 PM, said:

Newtaste,
Imparja/Southern Cross are yet to publically commit to this. What is your source?

Imparja's digital plans
There is no mention of which sites they will actually convert. Many of the sites in my list have populations of less than 500 which was listed in a DBCDE enquiry years ago.

Southern Cross Television. They only admit to transmitters in Alice Springs, Mt Isa and Roma.

They do not have to install transmitters until 2013.
The current list of broadcaster conversions

When the DBCDE. ACMA or the broadcasters list the sites I will modify my list.

AlanH

Confirmation on Digital Ready confirming Imparja will be available terrestrially:
http://www.digitalre...s...=17&group=1

The revised ACMA digital television channel plan for remote Central & Eastern Australia from May 2010.
http://www.acma.gov....p_rce_may10.pdf

The Digital Ready self-help list states that the existing Imparja and SC Central self-help sites will not be converted, with the implication being that broadcaster owned sites will be converted ... the same as all the other broadcaster owned sites in Australia.

According to the ACMA database, there are 27 SC Central (ITQ, QQQ - Regional Television Pty Limited) owned transmitters, and there are 23 Imparja (IMP - Imparja Television Pty Ltd) owned transmitters. There are differences in the numbers as in towns like Jabiru, SC Central owns it's transmitter, whereas West Arnhem Shire Council owns the Imparja transmitter.

But yes, as you said, you can change the list down the track.

Edited by newtaste, 25 August 2010 - 02:38 AM.

[Ramegabyte]

alanh, on Aug 25 2010, 12:49 AM, said:

DX fan,
Phased arrays are only available in channels 21 - 82.  
Only Yagi-Udas are available for restricted channel ranges.

As a DX fan you should be a fan of phased arrays for horizontally polarised signals and Yagi-Udas on their side for vertically polarised signals all in blocked paths. and with distance all paths are blocked by the curvature of the earth.

Yes, antenna height and position can affect the outcome.

The antenna Ramegabyte has bought is designed for band 3 - 5. Element for element the UHF section will have lower gain than one designed for band 4+. eg 01mm-DG21

Ramegabyte,
Jaycar CAT. NO. LT3138 phased array

AlanH

Thanks folks - will get one of these and try it - I'll let you know the outcome.

Cheers - Ramegabyte

[Brenny25]

Thanks Alan H for your comprehensive guide on how to choose an approriate antennae. We live in Crows Nest QLD and few months ago decided to switch to digital. We turned our Dick Smith phased array antennae (about 7 years old) to point towards Mt Mowbullan (60km away and not LOS as there is hills between the transmitter and our house), recabled with RG6 and replaced the old amplifier with a Kingray MHU44G. Have the amplifier gain up to full.

Digital reception is fine during the day then from 5pm to 6pm (dusk) all channels have pixelation. After 6pm, the reception comes good again. Can anyone explain why this happens?

The other day a bird knocked off one of the phased array elements, so we're looking at updating the antennae. A local installer said to put up a 91 element yagi instead of a phased array. However on reading this forum, I would say that a phased array is more appropriate? Can someone confirm this please for our scenario and of the H4+ listed by Alan H, are they all much the same or would one be more suitable for our situation?

[M'bozo]

Brenny25, on Sep 15 2010, 08:43 PM, said:

A local installer said to put up a 91 element yagi instead of a phased array. However on reading this forum, I would say that a phased array is more appropriate?

Without signal measurements on a digital meter, utilising a range of antennas to determine the most suitable, and the best mounting position on your property, such an answer is not always easy to give.

Having said that, in similar situations to yours (blocked terrain etc) I use these. They have their maximum gain mid range, rather than at a band end.

(They don't seem to get a guernsey around here, for some reason.)

I carry a 91 element yagi in my van, but haven't used one in over 3 years.

Also, your amplifier may have too much gain, turn it down to minimum to see if you still have an issue.

[alanh]

Brenny,
as Mbozo says a measurement of field strength is required.
There are 3 possibilities
1. Too little signal because the signal is either above or below the antenna.This is weather dependent, particularly temperature and humidity.
2. Too much signal. This may also be weather dependent
3. Interference from any arcing source which is used at that time. Typically motors both electrial and petrol, electric fences, switches and fluroescent lamps.

AlanH

[nik83]

Can you please help me. On our tv and another tv with a set top box channel 10 has been coming up with no signal. We have never had this problem before and have had the set top box for about 3 years and tv for 18 months. What could be causing this? We cannot get any digital 10 channels including one. We have not changed anything or moved anything and it seems strange it has done it to both. Will check the aerial later this afternoon but I'm just wondering if there could be any other causes I should check.

[alanh]

Nick,
Your question cannot be answered until you post what town or suburb you are in.

AlanH

[nik83]

alanh, on Nov 12 2010, 04:29 PM, said:

Nick,
Your question cannot be answered until you post what town or suburb you are in.

AlanH

I'm from Bargara 4670

[alanh]

Nik,
You are in the Wide Bay licence area.
Go to the first post in this area.
With digital all stations are in band 3 (channels 6 -12) except SBS. This is not the case for analog.

The most likely causes are;
A short circuit in the cable part the way along its length
Damage to the antenna
Corrosion in the antenna and cable connections
water in the cable.

In Wide Bay the Network Ten programs including One are transmitted on RF channel  9.

AlanH

[Wormyworm]

Folks,
Need a bit of help and am a bit of a newb when it comes to antennas.

We're in the Kirwan area of Townsville and use Mt Stuart as our transmitter. We have line of sight to the transmitter, except for the mass of palm trees in our neighbours yard.

We recently had a guy around to install a new antenna.
He put up a Matchmaster 01MM-DG27, and used the old coax with a new wall plate.

We get pretty good reception now. Our TV (12 mth old Sharp) shows signal strength of 90 on most channels but quality varies.
Most of the time it's OK, but on Channel 9, especially during the cricket, we get pixellation. Sound is OK.
We put the signal bars on the tv and they don't move. Signal quality is around 60.

Is this a signal problem or could it be the TV?
Is our next step to do the coax cable?
Do I need to cut down my neighbour's trees? (that's a joke, but maybe not!)

Any help would be very much appreciated.

Cheers


Chris

[alanh]

Chris,
I wish that installers would install the correct antennas. The one you have is designed of channels 6 - 12, 21 - 69.

Townsville
Analog
ABTQ RF channel 3 (ABC)
TNQ RF channel 7 (Network 10)
SBS RF channel 28
STQ RF Channel 34 (7 Qld)
RTQ RF channel 40 (WIN)

Digital
ABTQ RF channel 31 (ABC)
TNQ RF channel 36 (Network 10)
SBS RF channel 37
STQ RF channel 38 (7 Qld)
RTQ RF channel 41 (WIN)

So your antenna is not designed to receive ABC in analog, will receive the other analog signals which will be switched off by the end of this year. The antenna is not very sensitive to the channels your really want. With WIN be the weakest. I suspect that the installer is from a capital city.

Read the "Get the best reception" post in this strand and click on the H4+ link for an antenna designed for the channels you really do need. Other than for the palm trees next door, there is a clear view of the transmitter. The worst case is when the palm trees are wet.

AlanH

[Wormyworm]

alanh, on Jan 26 2011, 12:52 AM, said:

Chris,
I wish that installers would install the correct antennas. The one you have is designed of channels 6 - 12, 21 - 69.

So your antenna is not designed to receive ABC in analog, will receive the other analog signals which will be switched off by the end of this year. The antenna is not very sensitive to the channels your really want. With WIN be the weakest. I suspect that the installer is from a capital city.

Read the "Get the best reception" post in this strand and click on the H4+ link for an antenna designed for the channels you really do need. Other than for the palm trees next door, there is a clear view of the transmitter. The worst case is when the palm trees are wet.

AlanH

Thanks AlanH. I don't suppose I have much recourse to ask the installer to install a different antenna at no cost?
I'm not worried about the Analog, but I just finished watching the cricket on Nine (41) and it pixellates in at least one horizontal strip every 20 seconds or so. Grrrr!

Edit: And of course no rain tonight and hardly any wind at all.

Thanks again for your help,


Chris

Edited by Wormyworm, 26 January 2011 - 09:36 PM.

[alanh]

Chris,
It will depend on how old the installation is. It is obviously not doing what it is supposed to ie. giving reliable reception on all stations. So ask the installer to fix it. If they are denying the problem ask the installer to measure the Pre BER which should be lower in value from 8E-4. 8E-5 is more reliable than 8E-4. If they don't know how, then suggest what I have told you.

AlanH

[M'bozo]

Wormyworm, on Jan 26 2011, 10:35 PM, said:

I don't suppose I have much recourse to ask the installer to install a different antenna at no cost?

You can only try, although I would expect any difference in price of components to be accounted for. A professional should be wanting to give the best experience to the customer, one would hope.

At UHF, in a blocked path situation, as yours seems to be, selection of antenna type and position on the property is important. This should be the primary aim of the installer, allowing for factors such as impediments to reception, like foliage, or similar.

However, you might get lucky at buying a suggested antenna, installing it and having success, if you are up to it.  

[Wormyworm]

Thanks AlanH and M'bozo. It's great for a newb to get such knowledgeable and experienced help.
I'll go back to the installer and let you know how I go.

Cheers


Chris

[bbboy]

alanh, on Jan 26 2011, 12:52 AM, said:

Digital
ABTQ RF channel 31 (ABC)
TNQ RF channel 36 (Network 10)
SBS RF channel 37
STQ RF channel 38 (7 Qld)
RTQ RF channel 41 (WIN)

So your antenna is not designed to receive ABC in analog, will receive the other analog signals which will be switched off by the end of this year. The antenna is not very sensitive to the channels your really want. With WIN be the weakest. I suspect that the installer is from a capital city.

Read the "Get the best reception" post in this strand and click on the H4+ link for an antenna designed for the channels you really do need. Other than for the palm trees next door, there is a clear view of the transmitter. The worst case is when the palm trees are wet.

On that note, which of the H4+ listed are cheap (and readily available at local retailers)? I would love to upgrade my current antenna + cabling as a DIY project. RG6 quad shielded right?

I'm aiming at Mt Stuart as well (my ancient analogue antenna does but gets flaky reception on One HD from time to time)

[Digitaldelay]

I am trying to help my son-in-law get better digital reception. He has a HD STB and an analogue antennae that gives just over 50% signal strength and noticeable signal problems with 10 network digital.

Postcode is 4285 and the location is high on a ridge line and Cedar Vale, south of Jimboomba.

Can I ask for help in asking for digital antennae selection.?

[Digitaldelay]

Digitaldelay, on Jan 30 2011, 02:34 PM, said:

I am trying to help my son-in-law get better digital reception. He has a HD STB and an analogue antennae that gives just over 50% signal strength and noticeable signal problems with 10 network digital.

Postcode is 4285 and the location is high on a ridge line and Cedar Vale, south of Jimboomba.

Can I ask for help in asking for digital antennae selection.?

Edited by Digitaldelay, 30 January 2011 - 03:14 PM.

[kurtp]

I also live in Biloela and amazingly I can get all the channels that you can't and none of the ones you could Steveinqld.
Thanks heaps to those who helped, I'm hoping it helps me too.

Edited by kurtp, 29 April 2011 - 09:45 PM.