335 replies to this topic

[alanh]

Jack,
You only have just enough signal. The reception may get worse during heavy rain.
Read "Get the best reception post" at the start of this strand. Look at the link labelled Tas for your closest transmitter.

AlanH

[Electronicman]

Mt Barrow covers this area and as he has just moved in, the previous owner has taken the power supply for the booster - not the actual booster as JackSprat has since found out (which usually happens Friday afternoons when new owners takeover real eastate! The power supply is now useless to the previous owner without the booster   )

I have had success without boosters in this area but it depends exactly whereabouts in Sheffield JackSprat is. The two antennae on his mast would be  a vhf unit and a uhf unit combined by the booster. The vhf antenna would only be used by SC analogue! All other channels including SC digital would be received by the uhf antenna. This could need to be tweaked to find its sweet spot for ideal reception from Mt Barrow. The vhf could be removed if JackSprat has all digital TV's or STB's

The extra ABC channels would be extras picked up from other translators closer which do not have commercial stations, only the ABC and SBS. By using a booster, this has a tendency to pick up unwanted transmissions.

It would be best to get your set-up checked by an experienced antenna technician and this will ultimately save you time and money and get the best possible solution for your requirements!

McBozo would be the best qualified here, as this is in his area jurisdiction. (PM him when you have the required number of posts to allow you to do this on this forum!)

[JackSprat]

I started to read the information at the beginning of this thread during my lunch break today and it has left me totally without a clue. I can only just get by when I read the instruction manuals that come with the equipment.

So, electronicman, I am taking your advice and calling in a local technician to have a look at it for me. The person I rang is unavailable until May.

That is no big deal as I have much to do around here before the cold nights of winter set in.

Southern Cross is still OK on analogue, so I can get by in the meantime.

[JackSprat]

The man from Island Antennas came today, which was earlier than he was booked to come for, but it worked out alright as it was a day off for me.

I do not understand too much of what he said, but it was basically that there were three antennas connected to a 2 connector amplifier, which was too powerful and overloading from local and distant signals, and my TV's had picked up all these signals, which is why they were snowy and Southern Cross was breaking up..

Anyway, after a bit of discussion about digital and analog reception, he took the mast and the antennas down, and connected the amplifier to the fased array on the lean to, adjusted everything so I can get digital channels only and got rid of all the extra channels that don't do anything.

So it is a lot easier to use everything now which is important for our technology challenged family :-)

[Electronicman]

Good to see that you have your problems sorted out JackSprat - easy when you have a knowledgeable person such as Marc to call upon to sort them for you!  

[Alista]

Hi Guys i can't start a new topic yet becauz i'm new but is it possibleto get digital tv from Mt tassie in Vic using Highest Gain antenna and Best Amp? becauz our tv is **** down here! I can See the Sea so maybe the signals will travel across bass straight

and help would be great!

[alanh]

Ally,
I will start a post for you in this strand.

AlanH

[mtv]

alista, on Jul 8 2008, 09:49 AM, said:

is it possibleto get digital tv from Mt tassie in Vic using Highest Gain antenna and Best Amp? becauz our tv is **** down here! I can See the Sea so maybe the signals will travel across bass straight

alista,

In a word.... No.

Distance is close to 320Km and the signals bend over water.

There are freak conditions (called ducting) that may make reception possible on rare occasions, but certainly not regularly and reliably.

Forum member M'bozo would probably be the best person to advise you on what you may be able to do to improve your 'local' reception.

[M'bozo]

Alista,

Parts of Scottsdale were dead zones when I used to go there for analogue installs years ago.

I have not done any digital work there so I have no experience to guide me for an answer.

As mtv points out, signals from the mainland can be received under fortuitous conditions, usually completely random occurrences during the warmer months for up to days at a time.

I would suggest you need to get a site survey done to assess your requirements. Unless this has already been done.

Can you post just the street or rural road you are on, and the closest intersecting road? I can then use an online map service to see what your chances might be.

Marc.

[Alista]

Hi Again I have no problems with my reception from Mt Barrow it's great, no dead spots here! but i just thought that it may have been posible for me to get tv from Mt tassie.

I live on oakdene Road that comes off B84 (bridport Road) with a partial view of Bass Straight

Edited by alista, 10 July 2008 - 04:10 PM.

[M'bozo]

Alsita,

Sorry thought you had a poor reception problem, not a poor programme problem.

Can't help with that.

There is always PAY TV.

Marc.

[dgriffith]

Hi all,

Trying to decide the best way forward at present and need a few q's answered.

Firstly, my location - at Brandum Bay, western side of the Great Lake. Currently analog off Mt Barrow. I've a "long-ish"     UHF yagi that looks to be band 4/5 from the size of the elements and a VHF antenna joined by a diplexer feeding the TV by abut 10-5 metres of cable at present. Picture is generally OK on analog, some ghosting.

Plugging in a cheapo wintel STB to suss things out gives me ABC/SBS with 95% quality, a blocky/stuttering Ten, not much else. (I can never figure out what combination of TVT/TNT/TDT is what network....)

So the first question is:

Do the commercial stations at Mt Barrow have a lower power or different directionality? I'm at 1030 meters and theres a gap in the hills to the northwest that would very nearly give me line of sight to Mt Barrow. Spinning the VHF antenna round to point Hobart way (again, there's a convenient gap in the hills to the SSE) gives me a lock on WIN on VHF 7, (and still ABC/SBS on UHF) but an unusable picture and not much else.

I'm looking at getting a masthead amp, as the diplexer's fairly corroded, and the looking-very-hard-to-replace cabling into the house appears to be the cheapest stuff the previous owner could get. So the next question is, what particular amp should I look into? Possibly I could point the VHF antenna Hobart way and crank the VHF gain up to get reception from there without overloading the UHF channels from Launceston. There's a kingray one that looks alright (from DSE at $99-ish).

Finally, whats the most 'resilient' and sensitive STB these days? Clearly, a $69 Wintal STB is not the highest quality.....

Cheers
Dave

[mtv]

dgriffith,

Forum member M'bozo is probably the best to answer specific questions having local knowledge, however, the first step I would suggest is to replace the 'corroded' diplexer, as this will certainly be causing signal problems. Also replace any other connectors/cables that may be old and weathered. Use RG6 Quadshield cable and 'F' connectors.

Use an F-type diplexer.

Depending on the design of the existing antennas, they too 'may' require replacement.

I wouldn't go buying an amp just yet, until you have replaced the diplexer and other components as necessary.

If you need an amp after doing that, then it depends on what signal levels are obtained.... measured 'at the antenna'.

Healing STB's work well with marginal signals, however, you first need to rectify the problems, rather than trying to compensate for them.

[dgriffith]

mtv, on Sep 24 2008, 05:26 PM, said:

Healing STB's work well with marginal signals, however, you first need to rectify the problems, rather than trying to compensate for them.

In this particular case, I'd rather compensate for them as much as possible  

Mainly because of this:

The cable runs from the antenna, 9 metres through the ceiling of a room that has no roof cavity (Corrugated Iron on one side, Wooden stud in the middle, Ceiling on the other), down an internal wall and out to the TV. Lifting one piece of dodgy tin nearest the antenna reveals the coax firmly secured to the studs. Can't get up from under the floor, could possibly run it under the eaves, but it would still have to go through an outer and then internal wall to get to the TV. (who put the bloody TV there?). Don't want to disturb the 30 year old iron on top, so I would very much prefer to let that sleeping dog lie for now. I'm the only occupied house for about 10k's in any direction,  we're off-grid and there's not much of any electrical stuff nearby to radiate noise into my dodgy coax - my general concern is it's loss between here and there. At least it's not the old brown coax of yore, and looking at it further it does have a relatively good-looking braid/shield, so that's one thing I suppose.

I just find it interesting that ABC/SBS are great (at 95% strength/quality) and the commercial channels are non-existent. ABC's low enough down the band at 41 and coming in well enough that TNT on 38 should be at least visible/watchable. After some careful pointing and temporarily removing the diplexer, I can get TDT on 52 better, with some pixellation still. No sign of TVT on 50. Which makes me wonder if they're lower power or more tightly focused elsewhere. (Or I'm reading the channel list wrong    )

But I don't want to push ABC/SBS up too high with an amp to get the other UHF stations, which was why I was wondering if perhaps I should pull the other ones from Hobart on VHF with the other antenna where at least they'd be relatively close in signal strength.

[alanh]

Dave,
Firstly analog transmitters from Mt Barrow are all in band 4 except TNT9. The digital transmitters are all in band 5 with TNT and the ABC closest to band 4. Since Mt Barrow is around 70 km away and you have a partially blocked path I would replace the antenna with a high gain UHF phased array. You can add a band 5 only masthead amplifier if required. These are available at antenna suppliers and not electonics retailers such as Jaycar.

The cable situation is to replace the part exposed to the weather. You can get two sizes of F connector and a female/female cable joiner. The size of the F Connector must match the cable diameter. This connector must be protected from the weather.

Considering that Mt Barrow is around 80 km away and Mt Wellington is 128 km on a partially blocked path, I would forget Mt Wellington for continuous viewing.

AlanH

[M'bozo]

Dave,

When digital first started from Mt Barrow, I did a few surveys in the Cramps Bay area down by the water. Results weren't brilliant, in some spots VHF from Wellington was coming in, but since VHF is more susceptible to impulse noise, atmospheric & man made, I would tend to concentrate on UHF digital from Barrow.

The only way to correctly determine the best approach in a situation like yours is for someone with a digital field strength meter, a selection of antennas, the smarts to interpret the readings from the test results, in order to determine if digital reception is possible, and from which transmission site.

You can experiment with antennas yourself, however my experience shows that at UHF antenna positioning can be critical, even in a prime reception area. The UHF digital transmissions from Mt Barrow toward your direction are equal in power, so far as I can determine from publicly available sources, and almost unique in Australia in that they are some 2/3rds the power of the analogue transmitters, when elsewhere they are usually a quarter of the power. Were it not for this, a lot of areas that I cover would be bereft of digital reception.

Roger your not wanting to replace the in house cable. As suggested elsewhere, this can be attached to external cable with the appropriate connectors.

Hope this assists somewhat.

Marc.

[M'bozo]

Well, as of 29th September 2008, unless you are in the Imparja TV1 licence area, forget about receiving their service. They have taken a business decision not to provide out of area reception to addresses not within their TV1 licence region.

If you are not in a yellow region on these maps, it won't be happening. Existing subscribers will not be affected, and applications in before the 29th should still be approved.

Map 1


Map 2



Taken from the imparja website:

Quote

7.  RECEPTION OF IMPARJA FROM LOCATIONS OUTSIDE OUR LICENCE AREA WILL NO LONGER BE PROVIDED (updated 29 Sep 08)

Imparja Television is one of the two licensed commercial TV services covering remote Central and Eastern Australia TV1. Under the Broadcast Services Act Imparja is not permitted to provide a broadcast service outside its licence area, except with certain limited exceptions.

This includes both the ACMA managed “out of area” schemes and travellers who are normally resident outside our licence area but who may be visiting the remote areas for a time.

Under the Broadcast Services Act there is no compulsion on Imparja to provide such out of area access to our signal. Increasingly we are finding that applications for direct satellite access are coming from viewers outside our licence area and are placing an un-sustainable commercial and operational burden on us. It is also becoming increasingly obvious that the out of area schemes are being used as a means to circumvent the legal restrictions on our broadcast reception area.

Following an internal review therefore Imparja Television has decided to withdraw from the processes by which viewers whose place of residence is located outside our licence area have been able to  gain access to our broadcast services. This includes travellers and those who do not receive adequate reception from their local TV channels.

We will only be activating smartcards from applicants whose residence is located within our licence area.

If your main residence or the location of the satellite receiver (eg a fixed holiday home) is outside our licence area, regretfully we will decline to provide you with access to Imparja. This includes new applications in black spots.

If you believe your residence is within Remote Central and Eastern TV1 you may apply by letter, fax or email, providing supporting evidence (eg a map location or address details).

Further information on broadcast legislation and the restrictions and processes by which broadcasters are allowed to provide out of area reception are available on the Australian Communications and Media Authority (acma.gov.au or 1800 226 667).  The website also provides access to detailed maps of our licence area.

    *
      We are sure you will understand that Imparja will not be providing any telephone or email responses to this situation and that any comments or questions you may have should be directed to the relevant broadcasting authorities, or your local commercial TV broadcaster.

[M'bozo]

I've also been told that SCTV Central will be doing the same. If that information is correct, it will queer the pitch for a number of viewers, particularly if smartcards get upgraded and people subsequently lose access to these services.

[Alista]

Hi Guys
Wasn't sure where to post this or new topic but could anyone tell me how the tv stations get their "ratings" because i can't work it out how do they know that so many thousand people were watching a show or movie?

Thanks.

[alanh]

Ally,
This is not the correct strand however the answer is..
The ratings companies select a number of households in the capital city viewing area defined by the Australian Communications and Media Authority. They then place a microphone and encoder which is connected to the phone line behind the TV. Every hour this encoder is rung and a sample of the encoder's output is compared with what is being broadcast. If it matches the rating has one more viewer.


AlanH

[M'bozo]

The system I have seen used here in regional Tasmania (once) is each TV in a selected household has a "black Box" attached to the set. When a family member (or guest) watches TV, they have a handset that allows the box to determine who is actually watching at the time by a personalised button, and what is being watched (free to air, pay, video etc). This information is downloaded daily by telephone to a central collection point.

The family is especially selected to meet some form of demographic that will hopefully give a true and meaningful return for the gobs of money that advertisers expend as a result of utilising this information.

About 15 years ago, I was selected by telephone to fill out a time sheet to determine what media the house I was living in at the time utilised for entertainment. IIRC, most of our selections were ABC or SBS related, so it probably wasn't a good indication of the general population at large. I understand this method is still used.

Apparently, the companies claim to use vigorous scientific methods to determine the viewing habits of the population from an extremely small sample size.

[doctordaze]

Hi,

I'm after some help and although it's slightly unrelated to current discussion but I'm a noob and can't start a new thread.

My parents have recently re-locatedfrom Hobart to St Helens (8 or 9 weeks ago) and when I went up to set up all of their electronic stuff for them I discovered that we could only pick up the ABC digital tv broadcast.

I did a bit a reasearch and found that there wasn't a DTV signal in St Helens at the time. Does anyone know if that was changed recently or if it will in the near future. I was planning to go up and visit at Christmas but I couldn't stand the boxing day test match in analogue.

Sorry if this has already been answered, the forum search wasn't working and I lokked but couldn't find any info anywhere else.

Thanks in advance.

Doctordaze

[alanh]

Dr Daze,
ABNT37 is on air in digital from the St Helens site. No one else at present. For digital only a Band 4+ antenna is required. There are analog transmitters on this site, however. Look at the Transmitter list in the first post.

AlanH

[Alista]

Doctordaze

From my knowledge analogue in St Helens isn't too bad so you should be right. As Alan said there are no more details as yet but i will watch the acma lists for further developments. The commercial stations have been a little slow with the North West coast and it seems to be the trend with the East as well.
Hope that helps  

Edited by Alista, 25 November 2008 - 07:28 PM.

[doctordaze]

Thanks for the help guys. Just to make sure I understand - no commercial digital as yet and no indication as to when it will commence?