344 replies to this topic

[charlesc]

syrilion, on Oct 29 2007, 10:12 PM, said:

I think I have a fairly specific issue with reception and thought I'd ask the following prior to purchasing a new aerial.... I have really bad reception.

Hi syrilion, this seems to be your first post.  Welcome to the forum....

Before some specific stuff re your questions, you may want to put this post in a new topic in the Adelaide Geographic Viewers Forum.  To start a new topic, you will need to up your post count to 5 (please see info in my sig below).  So many new posts just go on the end of the 'main' thread.  They tend to be less visible there.  I think at the moment there are only 6 new topics in the Adelaide area.

Re your post, it really sounds like you need to have a site survey carried out with a digital field strength meter to see what signal you have (and from where). Then the best antenna can be selected, and further readings taken to find the best location for the antenna.

[syrilion]

Hi charlesc. Thanks for your reply. I had figured that I might need expert help, but like all men  I wanna do it myself!

Also I tried to post a new topic, but it wouldn't let me - must be the 5 post rule. Well, now I've done two!

Cheers,
Syrilion

[digitalj]

reported

[mello yello]

digitalj, on Dec 8 2007, 09:15 PM, said:

reported

WTF are you reporting Digital...you had too much cordial or something ?  

[digitalj]

mello yello, on Dec 8 2007, 09:26 PM, said:

WTF are you reporting Digital...you had too much cordial or something ?  

I Reported Spam, the reported Post serves no purpose.

[byte-me]

I have subscribed to this thread just to find out what the hell was reported cause for the life of me I can see no edited post and nothing that would warrant reporting.  

[Redleg]

Hi all,

Thanks to all the contributors - plenty of great info here.

I live at Glenunga near the foothills and am looking to upgrade my antenna system prior to purchasing a new TV.  Current antenna is an analogue VHF pointing to Mt Lofty.  Line of site is partially marred by a large tree - analogue SBS is woeful.  I could overcome the tree problem by putting the new antenna in a different location on the other side of the house.

I visited Hills Industries and they have a rough map showing "best" reception areas for VHF (Mt Lofty) and UHF (Adelaide) and, of course, the boundary is right down my street.  Houses in the vicinity are a mixture of VHF and UHF - mostly VHF but I suspect this might be mainly historical.

Given some of the comments such as "no band 3/4 antennae available" and "long VHF elements susceptible to noise induction" (I hope I have interpreted this correctly), and also the UHF transmitters being lower power than the VHF ones I am in a quandry.
Given that I might have a choice here, what would you guys go for - a VHF or a UHF antenna.  Whatever I choose, it will go in a new location and the old mast and coax distribution will be used as the basis for a separate FM (maybe omnidirectional) antenna system.

Cheers,

Redleg

[M'bozo]

Go Norwood  

You should be in the coverage area for Grenfell Centre in Glenunga. I would be aiming for UHF from there if there are no obstructions (buildings/trees etc) from your property, if nothing else because UHF is less affected by impulse noise.

You will need a band 5 antenna. Hills TMX18B5 part number FB607081B, or if your path is a obstructed Hills ULTIMAX36 (FB608542). Be aware that if there are issues with not having a clear line of sight to the transmitter, antenna location can be critical to success.

[dazza000]

I have a question for the Gurus as I cannot get SBS Digital where I am in Wistow near Mt Barker. I found out that the digital signal comes from the ntl tower summit rd Crafers, I got my GPS and put in the lat long for this spot and my antenna is pointing in the right direction. I thought that I may only have a VHF antenna only as SBS is the only station transmitted in UHF being channel 33 but I can get a rough picture on the old analogue TV so does this mean I do currently have a UHF and VHF antenna? as a bloke at work said that I had the wrong antenna but I'm not convinced.

Cheers

[M'bozo]

dazza000, on Dec 29 2007, 08:59 PM, said:

I have a question for the Gurus as I cannot get SBS Digital where I am in Wistow near Mt Barker. I found out that the digital signal comes from the ntl tower summit rd Crafers, I got my GPS and put in the lat long for this spot and my antenna is pointing in the right direction. I thought that I may only have a VHF antenna only as SBS is the only station transmitted in UHF being channel 33 but I can get a rough picture on the old analogue TV so does this mean I do currently have a UHF and VHF antenna? as a bloke at work said that I had the wrong antenna but I'm not convinced.

Cheers

Replied here

[vinvanmil]

Hello All,

I was wondering if there would be anybody here with an indoor antenna in the Payneham area to receive the HD channels? I have a clearly line of sight of the towers on Mt. Lofty from here, and as far as I can judge no obstacles at all (no trees, big buildings, etc.) - I would be roughly 5-8kms away (straight line) from the towers.

Cheers!

[mtv]

If your antenna is indoors, the house itself is an obstacle.

Mt Lofty from Payneham is probably more like 11km, but should make little, if any difference.

What problems are you experiencing?

[vinvanmil]

mtv, on Jan 30 2008, 11:07 PM, said:

If your antenna is indoors, the house itself is an obstacle.
Mt Lofty from Payneham is probably more like 11km, but should make little, if any difference.
What problems are you experiencing?

At the moment I don't have my HD TV as yet - but what I would like to avoid is that I've bought a panel and then realise I most definitely need an outdoor antenna... So I was just wondering if people in that area have used indoor antennas and are experiencing any problems.
A friend of mine, lives about 1 km down the road (maybe even less), has two very basic rabbit ears, placed in the corner behind his 42" Full plasma and has perfect reception. According to other in this forum, that's impossible or that he is really lucky...
He doesn't have the towers in line of sight, while I would have, through the windows) straight line of sight of the towers. So I was hoping that my reception would be as good as his... For what it's worth, my analogue reception is pretty good.

[M'bozo]

Try rabbit ears and see how you go.

Low cost.

And if it breaks up, get an outside antenna. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

(Had great fun when walking in Glenelg on Tuesday night.
Saw a set top box through an open window with rabbit ears on top.
Got the gas bbq igniter out of my pocket (don't ask) and fritzed the reception while operating it. Stopped on the way back from the beach and did it again. Viewer was not happy.
Geez, I'm an old so and so.)

But the point is there may be impulse noise issues from passing cars, operation of electrical appliances in your house etc, with the rabbit ears.

Even the movement of your body around the room may affect your digital reception.

[takai]

Im having a few issues getting reception at my place in Klemzig. I was using a DSE amplified bunny ears for a while, which was workable but needed to be reconfigured for each different channel (i.e. "ears" in different attitudes). So this weekend i got my butt into gear and got an AntSig 162 antenna, as pictured here:


The site there seems to indicate that im smack bang in the middle of the green "good" reception zone (http://www.radiospec...TV antennas.htm) and as such the antenna would be appropriate.

A quick search of the ABC site and the other PDFed site list shows that Mt Lofty/Norton Summit are my signal towers and that they are in the horizontal plane. So up on the roof i go and wire it all up, and point the sodding thing at Mt Lofty (well roughly since there is a tree in the LoS).

However im getting no reception apart from ABC, SBS and occasionally 7. Ive tried feeding the input through the DSE amplifier to no avail, and ive tried adjusting the antenna in poofteenths of degrees either way but nothing. My neighbours antennae are pointed in roughly the same direction, and they are fine despite the tree blocking LoS as well.

So im stumped. The one thing that has me puzzled is that i always thought that there needed to be some sort of resistance through the cable, but my multimeter shows that the tip and sheath are perfectly connected. I tested another couple of aerials and they are not.

The antenna had the balun preconnected to the array, and the wire is preconnected to the balun, presumably for idiotproof installation. However, where the balun is connected is a perfect shortcircuit through the antenna body. Is this supposed to be? I havnt looked deeply into antenna design since my highschool physics days, which is why im a bit rusty.

Any help would be vastly appreciated.

[mtv]

takai,

Firstly, the antenna in ths pic is nothing more than a caravan antenna and has very little gain.

Do your neighbours antennas look like that? My bet is they have a lot more elements.

Looking at the range of antennas on the website in your link, they do not stock ANY combination VHF/UHF antennas designed specifically for digital reception.

A digital antenna should not be capable of receiving any channel below channel 6, as channels below 6 are not used for digital in Australia.

Antsig antennas are very poorly made, in my opinion.

It's quite common for a reading from a multimeter to indicate a short, depending on the balun/dipole configuration.

I certainly wouldn't rely on that signal-coverage map, as there are numerous spots in the 'good' area which are very poor.

Ensure all your connections are ok.

Personally, I'd recommend returning tha antenna for a refund and going for something from Hills or Fracarro.

I have installed the Fracarro LP34HV in several areas around Adelaide, however, the choice of antenna ultimately depends on the available signals at any particular location, which are measured with a digital field strength meter.

Apart from the selection of the best antenna, the best mounting position can be critical.

Given your location and the fact (amplified) rabbit ears worked reasonably, a decent antenna should work ok, but without actual signal measurements, it's difficult to advise.

You should not need an amplifier, if the correct antenna is installed.

[takai]

Hm, ok. Point taken since the 162C seems to be a pissweak 1-2db gain antenna, with fairly nasty rolloffs.

Any ideas on where to get a decent antenna in SA. I searched high and low to try and find a place in Adelaide to buy antennas from, and it came down to the radio place, where i got that one, DSE, Jaycar and Bunnings (who just sold AntSig gear more expensively)....

[alanh]

takai,
Read the first post in this strand. Hills manufacture their antennas in Adelaide. Ring them and ask where you can get the Hills recommendations in the link.

AlanH

[takai]

Ok, so noting that i need a Band 3&4 antenna, the link in the first post doesnt list any 3/4 antennas. Should i just gun for a 3/4+ and cop the added frequencies on the cheek (of course at the loss of amplification).

That said, given the 8+db amplification on the SMX24B4+ i think that the attenuation from the added frequencies would be fine. Or is there a specific 3/4 antenna that you would reccomend since that other thread was posted?

I pulled out the physics books again last night, so im a fair bit more clued in again.

[M'bozo]

Takai,

See if you can get one of these click.

Try one of your L & H stores.

Don't lose sleep because it is B3/4/5. I expect the gain is the same as a Fracarro LP345HV which it resembles in appearance: 9dB for B3/4/5.

I replaced an existing antenna with one of these in Adelaide a couple of weeks ago - without anything more than a metric shifter & screw-on F connector - worked a treat. (they wouldn't let me bring my van on the plane, and couldn't afford it anyway.)

Bear in mind comments mtv has made in his post. They are valued judgements based on years of practical experience, with which I fully concur.

Marc.

Edited by M'bozo, 13 February 2008 - 05:21 PM.

[takai]

M, on Feb 13 2008, 05:13 PM, said:

Takai,

See if you can get one of these click.

Try one of your L & H stores.

Don't lose sleep because it is B3/4/5. I expect the gain is the same as a Fracarro LP345HV which it resembles in appearance: 9dB for B3/4/5.

I replaced an existing antenna with one of these in Adelaide a couple of weeks ago - without anything more than a metric shifter & screw-on F connector - worked a treat. (they wouldn't let me bring my van on the plane, and couldn't afford it anyway.)

Bear in mind comments mtv has made in his post. They are valued judgements based on years of practical experience, with which I fully concur.

Marc.

Cheers mate, i didnt realise L&H sold antennas, there is one a stones throw away.

Still bearing in mind the comments mtv has made, although just playing with the antenna seems to show me that i need a more powerful one. Plus i noticed that removing dipoles from the antenna i have doesnt do squat. My neighbours do have larger antennas, upon further inspection one is a Yagi/Log hybrid and the other has a Yagi UHF and a Log Periodic, which i assume is VHF only.

Ill check with the L&H if i can return the antenna if it doesnt work.

[M'bozo]

Good luck with it.

I cruised around a  new housing estate at Nairne & couldn't believe some of the antennas being used there, considering analogue will probably cease from Mt Lofty long before the rural areas in Tassie where most of my installs are. I'm thinking there really is a market in Adelaide for log periodics of the type referred to earlier.

My policy now is to convert as many of my customers to digital with analogue reception as a fortuitous result where possible.

Edited by M'bozo, 14 February 2008 - 06:08 AM.

[alanh]

For Adelaide main transmitters they only lose ABC analog.

AlanH

[mtv]

The log periodic in the link will probably work fine.

I totally agree with the band 4/5 on these antennas making negligible gain difference.

The quoted spec difference between band 4 on the Fracarro LP34 and LP345 is only 1dB, which if you rely on that much of a slight difference, a different antenna should be used anyway.

In practice, I have compared both side by side and both perform equally, so I now only stock the LP345.

[M'bozo]

mtv, on Feb 14 2008, 04:55 PM, said:

so I now only stock the LP345.

And I the LPV345F - smaller, same gain figure (roughly), easier to carry, and with a F connector

Edited by M'bozo, 14 February 2008 - 05:28 PM.