344 replies to this topic

[mtv]

The Joker, on Jun 5 2010, 07:10 PM, said:

Thanks Col for your advice . I live in Beulah Park and my antenna is mounted on the fascia board at the rear of the house facing Mount Lofty. The antenna has been up for many years and I have no idea of the make or model. I will need to check the 4 way splitter in the roof as this was also added a few years ago when adding an additional TV. It seems if the 4 way splitter and the cabling is of good quality , I will need a professional installer to check and perhaps move or update my antenna . Do you recommend any particular brand and model for Beulah Park?
Cheers

If you have a clear view of the transmission towers on Mt Lofty, then a Fracarro LP34F should do the job, or perhaps a Hills Spectramax SMXB4+

Both antennas are specifically designed for optimum digital reception, although different designs and pricing.

I've had success installing both in some suburbs around Adelaide... but not having installed either in Beulah Park, I couldn't say with any certainty which would be best for you.

It all depends on accurate signal measurements at your location and a local installer would have a better idea of what signal are like in general, in your area.

If you could post a pic of your existing antenna, I could probably identify it.

There are also UHF translators at 25 Grenfell St, but as your reception is generally Ok from Mt Lofty, I'd say stick with that transmission site.

[The Joker]

mtv, on Jun 5 2010, 07:14 PM, said:

If you have a clear view of the transmission towers on Mt Lofty, then a Fracarro LP34F should do the job, or perhaps a Hills Spectramax SMXB4+

Both antennas are specifically designed for optimum digital reception, although different designs and pricing.

I've had success installing both in some suburbs around Adelaide... but not having installed either in Beulah Park, I couldn't say with any certainty which would be best for you.

It all depends on accurate signal measurements at your location and a local installer would have a better idea of what signal are like in general, in your area.

If you could post a pic of your existing antenna, I could probably identify it.

There are also UHF translators at 25 Grenfell St, but as your reception is generally Ok from Mt Lofty, I'd say stick with that transmission site.

Thanks Col for more advice. I have managed to find my old invoice and it states that a Hills PF17 antenna was installed in 1994. I don't have an an absolute clear view of Mt Lofty as the neighbour built a double carport which partially blocks a direct line of sight with its colorbond gable.  Do you still recommend the above antennas to improve my signal quality?
thanks again

[mtv]

The Joker, on Jun 5 2010, 08:10 PM, said:

Thanks Col for more advice. I have managed to find my old invoice and it states that a Hills PF17 antenna was installed in 1994. I don't have an an absolute clear view of Mt Lofty as the neighbour built a double carport which partially blocks a direct line of sight with its colorbond gable. Do you still recommend the above antennas to improve my signal quality?
thanks again

The PF17 wasn't designed for all the digital channels, so an upgrade would probably help, however, having a metal structure close to your antenna directly in the signal path may be a major issue.

Considering your existing antenna is performing reasonably, it's possible just relocating it may be all that's needed, but given it's age, it may be deteriorating anyway.

Have you checked the balun where the coax connects to the antenna?

An antenna of that age may have rust/corrosion on the connecting terminals.

It's also quite possible you have old coax cabling that doesn't perform well with digital signals.

The Hills Spectramax model I mentioned would be the closest replacement for your existing antenna and it's specifically designed for channels 6-12 & UHF for SBS.

If you want to try improvements yourself, ensure all your coax is RG6 Quadshield, with an F splitter and use fully-shielded connectors throughout.

As for the antenna and mount.... I would strongly recommend having an installer with a digital meter/spectrum analyser perform a site test, to determine the most suitable antenna and most importantly.. the best mounting location for your antenna.

[The Joker]

mtv, on Jun 5 2010, 08:52 PM, said:

The PF17 wasn't designed for all the digital channels, so an upgrade would probably help, however, having a metal structure close to your antenna directly in the signal path may be a major issue.

Considering your existing antenna is performing reasonably, it's possible just relocating it may be all that's needed, but given it's age, it may be deteriorating anyway.

Have you checked the balun where the coax connects to the antenna?

An antenna of that age may have rust/corrosion on the connecting terminals.

It's also quite possible you have old coax cabling that doesn't perform well with digital signals.

The Hills Spectramax model I mentioned would be the closest replacement for your existing antenna and it's specifically designed for channels 6-12 & UHF for SBS.

If you want to try improvements yourself, ensure all your coax is RG6 Quadshield, with an F splitter and use fully-shielded connectors throughout.

As for the antenna and mount.... I would strongly recommend having an installer with a digital meter/spectrum analyser perform a site test, to determine the most suitable antenna and most importantly.. the best mounting location for your antenna.

Thanks again. Will check out all of the above. Should I buy the Antenna directly from Hills or just go through the Installer?Any idea how much they retail for?

[mtv]

The Joker, on Jun 5 2010, 09:58 PM, said:

Thanks again. Will check out all of the above. Should I buy the Antenna directly from Hills or just go through the Installer?Any idea how much they retail for?

I'd go through the installer, because until the site test is performed, you won't know which antenna is the most suitable.

[The Joker]

mtv, on Jun 5 2010, 11:19 PM, said:

I'd go through the installer, because until the site test is performed, you won't know which antenna is the most suitable.

thanks for all your advice Col
Cheers

[alanh]

MTV,
You are finally learning from me
"If you have a clear view of the transmission towers on Mt Lofty, then a Fracarro LP34F should do the job, or perhaps a Hills Spectramax SMXB4+"

As you will see from the first post and as you know I have been recommending the Hills Spectramax SMX14B4+ and SMX24B4+ for many years, however there are now other antennas more tuned to the mainland capital cities. There will be no main tranmitters in capital cities on channels 37 - 49.

I'm surprised you have not commented on auction of the 400 - 519 MHz band to which the Fracarro Log Periodics are designed to receive.

AlanH

[mtv]

alanh, on Jun 6 2010, 07:40 PM, said:

MTV,
You are finally learning from me

AlanH

AlanH,

My, my.... what an arrogant statement!..... but hardly surprising from you.

I have always maintained that I use a variety of antennas for different jobs.

This is why a site test should be performed to determine which antenna will provide reliable reception at a particular location.

I certainly did not learn that from you, as you have no practical experience as a professional antenna installer and don't perform site tests.

You just make recommendations from 'theory' or antenna specs you find on internet sites...  hardly a basis for 'real-world' conditions.

Your post has done nothing to assist The Joker with their reception issue, so I would ask you to refrain from posting again until you have something useful (to the readers) to contribute.

[purpleninja]

Hi guys.

Any advice on the best antenna to go for in Rosslyn Park in SA for general TV use?

Single storey house, steel frame, Colorbond roof - not sure if that matters.

Also are any installers recommended by the Forum experts in Adelaide, or is it just a matter of going with a chain like Mr Antenna or Jim's Antennas?

Thanks

[mtv]

purpleninja, on Jun 6 2010, 10:55 PM, said:

Hi guys.

Any advice on the best antenna to go for in Rosslyn Park in SA for general TV use?

Single storey house, steel frame, Colorbond roof - not sure if that matters.

Also are any installers recommended by the Forum experts in Adelaide, or is it just a matter of going with a chain like Mr Antenna or Jim's Antennas?

Thanks

purpleninja,

You are in a very similar situation to The Joker, so the posts above would also be appropriate for you.

I'm not aware of any pro installers on the forum in Adelaide, apart from M'bozo who visits from time to time.

I'm rarely in Adelaide these days.

The franchise installers can vary.... depending on the installer you get on the day.... some are very good, some aren't.

Try to locate an installer who uses a professional digital field strength meter/spectrum analyser and who performs a site test to determine which antenna performs best at your location and the best mounting location for it.

[purpleninja]

mtv, on Jun 6 2010, 11:26 PM, said:

purpleninja,

You are in a very similar situation to The Joker, so the posts above would also be appropriate for you.

I'm not aware of any pro installers on the forum in Adelaide, apart from M'bozo who visits from time to time.

I'm rarely in Adelaide these days.

The franchise installers can vary.... depending on the installer you get on the day.... some are very good, some aren't.

Try to locate an installer who uses a professional digital field strength meter/spectrum analyser and who performs a site test to determine which antenna performs best at your location and the best mounting location for it.

Thanks for the quick and informative response Col - much appreciated

I'll make sure when I ask installers to come to quote that they have a professional digital field strength meter/spectrum analyser and that they intend to perform a site test

[sam724]

Hi all,
This is a very informative site I've stubled across and I (think) I've learnt alot reading through the various posts.
I am building a house in McLaren Flat S.A. and wish to try and save some hard to find cash by (attempting) to install a TV antenna,
I've installed them before and have had success with obtaining a perfect picture. My plan is to install a Hills antenna as the missus works
for one of their many companies and can obtain some discount. After ringing Hills, I informed them that I believe I would require
the PHD1 or PHD2 antenna and was advised that I'd need the PHD2 for the area. After reading through some posts I understand the
Spectramax series to be a better constructed antenna, I rang Hills back to enquire about the SMX28B4 and this time I was told I would
require the PHD3 for the area, as it was "cut" for digital, I was told the Spectramax was "cut" for analogue and digital. Can someone please
tell me which is a better constructed antenna, the PHD3 or the SMX28B4 ? their differences?... and of course which one would better suit my situation?
I guess-timate McLaren Flat to be approx. 30kms from Mt. Lofty in a straight line. I plan to have a total of 4 TV points in the house
with varying lengths of cable feeding them, 3 would be close to the same length, approx. 7-10m to the splitter and the longest approx. 10-12m
to the splitter. I understand there's losses involved with splitters and cable length, would I need an amplified splitter? or will a basic splitter
do? If I need an amplified splitter, should the shorter runs of cable be the same length as the longest run? with the excess coiled up?
I plan to use RG6 quad shield cable with compression F-type connections as I understand this to be the way to do it, is this correct?
The antenna will be mounted on a rafter mounted mast, which I plan to situate close to the ridge cap of the iron roof, ie: close to the
highest point of the roof.
I understand it's advisable to have a site test done, but I'm hoping I can (jag) a decent reception before having to pay someone.
Any help would be appreciated, go easy on me  

[sam724]

oops, I forgot... I only require digital channels.

[alanh]

Sam,
If you look at the first post in this strand look at the transmitter list to pick the most appropriate antenna type. Use Quad shielded cabling with F connectors. Try your installation out with only one TV connected and no splitters. If the reception is fine, then add the splitter and try again if it is not reliable then an amplifier may be required. Post again if this is a problem.

AlanH

[M'bozo]

sam724, on Jun 25 2010, 05:36 PM, said:

I understand it's advisable to have a site test done

That's the best way.

I wouldn't suggest a rafter mount, as what do you do if it turns out this is not the best spot for the antenna? Better to have (IMO) a mount that fits on the roof itself.

I've only used PHD1's in Adelaide, and only as far as Sheidow Park in your direction, so can't comment about specifics, except I'm not sure what the "cut for digital" comment refers to. Both PHD + SMX antennas cover the same VHF range for digital, the SMX covers more channels on UHF, I think it's splitting hairs if this is what they mean by "cut for analogue & digital".

The cable lengths in your situation are not critical, run them to a point where you can get easy access to the splitter (eg above manhole). Quadshield RG6 cable & compression connectors are fine (The compression tool can be expensive, depending on the connector type, unless you can borrow said tool)

Whether amplification is needed or not can only be determined by aforementioned site test. Quickly looking at a map suggests you don't have any obstructions between you & Mount Lofty, is this the case?

[sam724]

Thanks Alan & M'bozo,

Alan, I looked at the first post and I believe both the PHD3 & SMX28B4 antennas fall into the category of H34?

M'bozo, I didn't understand what the "cut for digital" comment meant either, from what I can gather both antennas are almost identical, ie: they cover channels 6 thru 12 in VHF and channels 28 thru 36 in UHF but doing a search tells me that the SMX28B4 is also covering channel 37, I don't see this as
being a difference worth considering, correct? I really wanted to know more about their longevity/construction and if I would be correct in choosing one of these antennas for the area? ie: do I need the gain?.. is it possible to have too much gain?... can this only be determined by having a site test performed?

I understand what you mean in relation to having a rafter mount in the wrong place, my plan was to set it up roughly to determine, where I should mount it. But I guess the site test is the only (accurate) way to work it out.

I didn't plan on the compression tool being expensive, I thought maybe $30-40, after I get the missus' discount, which would then be useful for any
other work/repairs.

In relation to obstructions, If you mean the landscape? I'm sure the path to Lofty is a bit up and down, visible hills are to the east, called "the range" but from what I can work out the signal would run parallel to these hills.

Am I correct in assuming you're a professional antenna installer M'bozo?.....
Would you be interested in doing a site test? (when the time comes, a few months away yet) if so, how much would I be looking at? I could then supply the neccesary equipment (antenna/splitter) per your advise and mount the antenna myself, again per your advice, to save a bit of money, the cables will already be installed, so I guess all that would be necesary is to test/tweak the system after you hook it up.

Thanks again for your responses, much appreciated.

[alanh]

Sam,
The cut for digital means that it does not have the elements which are upto 2 m long designed to pick up channels 1 - 5A which will never be used for digital TV because of signal break ups frpm arcing in electrical systems. So both the PHD and SMX range are cut for channels which are used for digital TV.

The difference between the Spectramax is that it is in the H34+ group which is channels 6 - 12, 28 - 49. The Platinum series is designed for main transmitters in state capital cities. it is H34 which is channels 6 - 12, 28 - 36. All Adelaide main digital transmitters will be within the channel range 6 - 12, 28 - 36. This does not apply to the foothills coverage from Grenfell St or the new repeaters to be put in Adelaide surrounds. See the transmitter list in the first post in this strand.

The wider the channel range the less sensitive the antenna is for some channels within their design range.

As far as constuction of the antennas go, in both cases the maximum element length is around 0.75 m instead of 2 m, so there is less stress on joints between the elements and the boom.

M'bozo can answer the rest of your enquiries.

AlanH

[M'bozo]

sam724, on Jun 28 2010, 10:47 AM, said:

Would you be interested in doing a site test?

Text your email address to me and I'll get back to you.

Marc.

Edited by M'bozo, 29 June 2010 - 04:16 PM.

[sam724]

Thanks Alan
Have SMS'd email address Marc

Much appreciated.

[krys1224]

Hi all,

I currently have two TV problems I am hoping someone can help me with!

1. I currently live in Salisbury East and we moved our antenna jack in the wall in our bedroom from near the ceiling (not sure why any electrician would put a jack in the ceiling!) to down near the floor and we have lost all channels on our TV except all the Channel 7's.  Does anyone have any idea why?  I tried an Auto Scan and still couldn't pick any others up.  We are still using the same antenna cable from the TV to the wall and the other two TV's in our house pick up all channels.

2. We bought a new TV in our lounge room and can no longer get SBS.  The old TV could get it and the other TV in the house gets it, but the new Panasonic doesn't.  We are still using the same aerial cord and the same plug in the wall. I tried an Auto and Manual tune with no luck.  I rang Panasonic and they said it wasn't their problem.

[alanh]

Krys,
It sounds as if there is no antenna connected at all.
Read the first post in this strand.

Get an antenna installer who can measure the digital errors.

AlanH

[krys1224]

alanh, on Jul 26 2010, 04:34 PM, said:

Krys,
It sounds as if there is no antenna connected at all.
Read the first post in this strand.

Get an antenna installer who can measure the digital errors.

AlanH

Hi Alan,

There is definately an antenna connected.  It is on our roof and the black cable comes into the roof and then goes to a splitter box where it splits into three black cables that head to the three different antenna points in our house.  When we had the cover of the splitter box off last night, we could get channels 7, 9, 10 and 2 (still not SBS), but as soon as the cover on the splitter box went back on, the channels disappeared.

Krys

[alanh]

Krys,
It sounds as if the signal is being shorted out. Check your new wiring. The short will be between the centre wire and the screen on the outside of the insulation but under the black covering.

If the splitter does not use the 'F' connectors but uses a saddle instead, check that the centre copper wire only connects to the screw. The screen including the matted wires should all be under the saddle. Ensure that the shield does not pass more than a mm past the saddle on the inside.

Does the antenna have elements about 200 mm long? The elements are at right angles to the boom (holds the antenna together)

Check the antenna for corrosion, bent and broken components.

AlanH

[charlesc]

Krys,
(assuming here that you do have the older style saddle-and-screw splitter).

As well as the points AlanH has identified above, you may also find that as the splitter cover is put back on there is pressure on the small circuit board, causing it to flex and cause intermittent contact.
It may be time to replace the splitter, and verify the wiring is not shorting.  Or even better, replace the splitter with a new F-connector shielded one (but you'll need to crimp up some cables).

[doyle63]

What other channels other than metro, can be received in adelaide i live in rosewater