635 replies to this topic

[rothki]

alanh, on Jun 16 2010, 02:19 PM, said:

Tom,
The interference becomes worse at night and when it rains weakens the TV signal from Bickely, Walliston and Carmel.

The Hamersley transmitter site only transmits 720, Radio National and NewsRadio.

AlanH

Hi Alan, thanks for that. It is interesting. Now i have lost channel 10 aswell. I am not sure at the time that the signal changes, but during the day both are at around 80-90% sig quality. after about 4.30 to 5 ish they go down to about 10%. not enough to get any picture. A few of my neighbours are having similar problems now. very interesting.

[Harry]

MLXXX, on Jun 3 2010, 10:47 PM, said:

Just above is another illustration of alanh replying to post contents that existed only in his imagination [not what charlesc actually posted].

Alanh,
can you please try to understand that almost every technical person with a knowledge of antennas will be aware that log periodics do not have a particulary good gain?

It is well known that the log periodic is an antenna design useful for covering a wide range of frequencies with moderate gain and directionality.

This lack of gain will only make a practical difference to reception of digital TV in challenging reception locations or environments.

For less challenging locations and environments, it can be a practical and effective low cost antenna.
________________

All,
I will not presume to try to provide advice on reception troubleshooting particularly where RFI is an issue but I note that Harry reported a strong signal and good reception for his PC TV tuner and set top box, using the Fracarro antenna erected 2 - 3 years ago. His Panasonic TV had usually been showing 100% signal strength and quality.

I am amazed at alanh's confidence in this post:

I am confident that alanh will not offer to refund the cost of the new antenna if Harry buys and installs a new antenna [and antenna filter] based on alanh's advice and yet SBS and WestTV prove not to be stable with the Panasonic TV.

I note that the alanh disagnosis algorithm has taken it for granted that there is no fault with the Panasonic TV's tuner.

Well after over a month the problem that occurred seriously for over a week and then less so for another week has not returned. I have changed nothing and signals are 100% for all channels.
So problem was not my antenna, amps etc was not the tuner in the Panasonic although I suspect it is not as good as the set top one .
Problem must have been local interference of some sort,  a temporary obstruction between my antenna and the Bickley area (Crane ?), some messing around at the transmitter site.
One thing I did think of is that the new BOM Radar was being commissioned around that time, since it probably is almost certainly also used for military purposes maybe some testing was going on between it and Pearce...who knows ??

Anyway no problems and the World Cup and the Tour de France are picture perfect on SBS HD

[hrh]

Harry, on Jul 5 2010, 12:31 PM, said:

Problem must have been local interference of some sort,  a temporary obstruction between my antenna and the Bickley area (Crane ?), some messing around at the transmitter site.
One thing I did think of is that the new BOM Radar was being commissioned around that time, since it probably is almost certainly also used for military purposes maybe some testing was going on between it and Pearce...who knows ??

The new site for the weather radar is south west of Serpentine township and I seriously doubt that would have any impact on your reception. There is also an existing one on the northern outskirts of the Perth airport. If they were causing any adverse affects you wouldn't be the only one and we certainly would have heard about it one or another.
Nor would there be any "messing around" as such at all the transmitters at the same time.

I would put my money on local interference. I noticed earlier this year that I was getting a lot of break up and dropouts on ABC and Ten digital (real channels 12 and 11) at random times in the evening, and on analog there was noticeable interference as you might get from an electric motor with brushes or from the ignition of an internal combustion engine nearby so I went outside and noticed that next door had a compact fluorescent light on the back corner of their house and it was flickering like it was going to die. As soon as it was turned off the interference and breakup stopped - when they turned it on, back came the problems. They have replaced the globe thankfully. All the while signal strength and quality as shown on the PVR did not change from when it was good to when it was bad.

It is also possible that the tuner in the TV may be not as good as the STB in dealing with spurious interference.

Edited by hrh, 06 July 2010 - 12:10 AM.

[MLXXX]

Harry, on Jul 5 2010, 02:31 PM, said:

Problem must have been local interference of some sort, ...

Anyway no problems and the World Cup and the Tour de France are picture perfect on SBS HD

Good to hear.

[Wimpey]

Hi all,

Trying to find some suggestions on why i may be loosing all the 7 network channels? I'm in the Wanneroo area towards east end of Dundebar rd and for last 12 months or so ch7, 7two etc just disappear and no amount of retuning etc finds them. Then all of a sudden a few days, or weeks later they will appear without anything being done. Up until then the same set up was working fine.

Haven't had ch7 reception for couple months now but then it magically appeared on Friday evening around 9pm left the Tv running in the background on ch7 and i got a full 3hrs of reception till it went again.

When i get reception the signal info on my TV (Samsung Plasma) shows Bit Error Level 0 and Signal strength around 85%. No reception and its BER 10 and signal 0% !! Next door neighbour still has reception, though he had similar issue couple months back.

Had a guy out looking at the problem, he ran around the roof trying different locations, heights etc with his meters and could get zilch! from ch7 using my antenna, so he tried a brand new antenna and same result so obviously no point in checking anything between antenna and TV, every other channel is fine. I have ch7 reception on analogue though not the best picture but you know its there. Funny thing couple wks after the guy looked at it i came home one night flicked through the channels and ch7 was working perfectly, lasted 3 days that time!  

Any ideas before i end up re-doing all my cabling etc or a GOOD antenna guy in the area that i could get round to do some more testing..

Frustrated to say the least...

[mtv]

Wimpey, on Oct 2 2010, 09:26 PM, said:

Hi all,

Trying to find some suggestions on why i may be loosing all the 7 network channels? I'm in the Wanneroo area towards east end of Dundebar rd and for last 12 months or so ch7, 7two etc just disappear and no amount of retuning etc finds them. Then all of a sudden a few days, or weeks later they will appear without anything being done. Up until then the same set up was working fine.

Haven't had ch7 reception for couple months now but then it magically appeared on Friday evening around 9pm left the Tv running in the background on ch7 and i got a full 3hrs of reception till it went again.

When i get reception the signal info on my TV (Samsung Plasma) shows Bit Error Level 0 and Signal strength around 85%. No reception and its BER 10 and signal 0% !! Next door neighbour still has reception, though he had similar issue couple months back.

Had a guy out looking at the problem, he ran around the roof trying different locations, heights etc with his meters and could get zilch! from ch7 using my antenna, so he tried a brand new antenna and same result so obviously no point in checking anything between antenna and TV, every other channel is fine. I have ch7 reception on analogue though not the best picture but you know its there. Funny thing couple wks after the guy looked at it i came home one night flicked through the channels and ch7 was working perfectly, lasted 3 days that time!

Any ideas before i end up re-doing all my cabling etc or a GOOD antenna guy in the area that i could get round to do some more testing..

Frustrated to say the least...

This may be entirely unrelated to your problem, but I have seen an issue with certain computer case and power supply fans in Antec computer cases kill digital Ch 7 reception.

Something to check for with either yourself or even neighbours using one.

Faulty signal amplifiers is another reasonably-common cause.

There are other sources of interference which may single out one channel of group of frequencies, such as overloading ABC analogue TV, FM and AM radio signals, corrosion/rust on connections, poor connections, etc.

Did your local antenna guy check all the above?

[alanh]

Wimpey,
Use one of the antenna installers who advertise on this site.
You are near the transmitter site for 6IX and 6TCR, however it usually gives problems with channel 10

You need one of the antennas in the first post with the link H34 with the higher number of dBs

MTV,
Your generalised information does not cut it He makes no mention of any masthead or other amplifiers
There is no high powered AM in the area, and channel 2 interference affects channel 8 and  9. The theory says this and he is not complaining of problems with these channels.

Are you now claiming local knowledge for every area of Australia?

AlanH

[mtv]

alanh, on Oct 2 2010, 10:17 PM, said:

Wimpey,
Use one of the antenna installers who advertise on this site.
You are near the transmitter site for 6IX and 6TCR, however it usually gives problems with channel 10

You need one of the antennas in the first post with the link H34 with the higher number of dBs

MTV,
Your generalised information does not cut it He makes no mention of any masthead or other amplifiers
There is no high powered AM in the area, and channel 2 interference affects channel 8 and 9. The theory says this and he is not complaining of problems with these channels.

Are you now claiming local knowledge for every area of Australia?

AlanH

alanh,

That's what it was.. generalised, as any of those issues I mentioned can cause reception loss in any area.

Are you now saying overloading signals can't cause signal loss?

Nope... I'm certainly not claiming local knowledge for every area of Australia... only you do that!

Ah yes... theory, your favourite category.

Hey, here's a thought alanh...... you're in Perth, why don't you go up to Wanneroo and fix Wimpey's problem?.... Ah yes.. I forgot briefly, you are not and have never been a professional antenna installer.

Attacking me does nothing to help Wimpey, only your ego.

Once again, your comments are only intended to disrupt threads and incite arguments.... classic trolling.

If you have nothing useful to add, please refrain from posting.

[Wimpey]

Hi AlanH & Col thanks for the replies... I can't remember the exact model number of antenna i have but its made by the same manufacturer of antenna as the one the technician tried.
I'll check it again in the morning and compare with ones at beginning of this topic.

I could safely remove cabling, connections etc out of the equation as with a direct connection between test equipment and antenna showed no reception from ch7 on the technicians meter, others were fine. The local WTV on ch44 has good picture quality.
No mast head or other amps just a splitter in roof space to take another cable into a bedroom all cable terminated with f connectors apart from end of cable to TV connection.

I'll check out some of the installers that advertise on here and try getting another inspection done. May just be a matter of finding a different location & height to mount the antenna..

cheers
Ryan

[pupiluv]

Hi,

Have to ask who is a reliable satellite dish & cabling company in Perth? Have a friend who moved to Perth but satellite pay tv not hooked up cos her provider's installer is MIA? Her english is basic but the pay TV company should be able to organise schedule on her behalf.

[happy1]

Hi,
Trying to get the DVT channel reception in northern part of Wanneroo.
So far I'm only getting channel 44, WTV, but none of the others, Seven/Nine/10 etc.

Signal strength for 44 WTV is below average, but picture still seems perfect.

I'm using a 5 year old LG tuner, and a new digital only antenna from a wholesale place in wangara.

what could be wrong?

are all the channels originating from one mast?

is polarity a tuner setting, or physically rotate antenna?

Cheers

[alanh]

Happy1,
What brand and model of antenna did you buy?
What is your street name and are you in Wanneroo itself or a suburb north of the Wanneroo town site?
Do you get SBS?

At the distance you are from the 3 transmitter towers, the difference it will make is about 2 degrees, which is not a problem.

My initial reaction is a poor cable connection.

AlanH

[happy1]

Thanks AlanH,
The antenna receipt says: Fracarro Band 3 & 4, Ch 6-12, 28-40.

I put in a second hand distribution amplifier from Ebay,  Make Hills HTA104.  Maybe I should throw that out of the equation until I have got it working..

Also, the direction of my antenna was set rather approximately, ( roughly same direction as neighbours ) I did some adjustment to get the signal better, but maybe I'm still off course.
I have put the antenna as high as possible, however there is a tall gumtree approx 40 meters away, where the log and a few branches are almost in the path of the antenna.  Not sure how sensitive it will be for a few tree branches?

I will have another go at it, and see if I can get better signal.

The address is somewhere near Carramar Golf course.

Cheers

[alanh]

Happy,
Try connecting the antenna to the TV without the amplfier and see what happens.

AlanH

[Sashko]

Hi Everyone

I would like to get some recommendations on good quality antennae suppliers/installers.

Our antennae is at least 20 years old and the reception recently degraded to an almost unwatchable level on some channels. Went up to inspect and the cable is weathered real bad. So i figure time to invest in re-cabling and a new antenna.
So would like some advice on some good installers. I release you most likely cant advertise directly in the forum so feel free to PM me your recommendations.

I read in another post to check out the guys that advertise on this site, but could not find any advertising except for the auto created google add bar.

Thanks in advance to everyone for your recommendation.
Sash

[alanh]

Sashko,
Read the first post in this strand.

If you are not in the Rolystone/Armidale area you need to click on the link in that post called H34. This will give you a list of recommended antennas. Which one is determined by the measurements taken on a Digital field strength meter. The cabling should be quadshielded RG6 using F connectors.
Some installers have not purchased a digital field strength meter, prices start at $4000.

Click on the Perth advertisers on this site or check each installer out to see if they have a digital field strength meter prior to considering them.

AlanH

[Jarod63]

Hi. I hope this is in the right place.
I live in Craigie and have been told that I am in a poor reception area. I had what the installer called a high-gain antenna installed a few years ago and he told me that the only way to get better reception is to put up a mast. I assume that this antenna is one that does not pick up channels 0 to 5A as I cannot get analog channel 2. I have quad shielded cable and f-type connectors.
I am in a duplex unit and most of the time I don't have a problem with impulse noise unless the airconditioner or washing machine etc are running. Before the high-gain antenna was installed I used to get alot of impulse noise from the other unit.
The signal strength on my PVR on pretty much all channels fluctuates between 40% and 50%. Alot of the time I can see the bar going up and down 1 or 2 %. The signal quality, however, is around 70% to 80%.
Every year at Christmas, my neighbour in the other unit puts flashing lights on her Christmas tree. These lights cause frequent interference (every few seconds) which ranges from a slight picture breakup to complete breakup, audio dropouts and a high pitched 'pop' sound from my TV speaker. It is definitlely the lights causing the problem as it only happens when my neighbour is home at night and the lights are on. I would have thought that Christmas tree lights would not pull enough power to cause such interference. The lights are very bright and I have wondered if they are safe.
Although the problem only happens for a few weeks a year, it drives me almost to distraction and makes watching TV almost unbearable. I know that if I said something she'd either stop the lights from flashing or would turn them off completely but I don't want to be a Scrooge and spoil her Christmas. She recently switched to digital and I hoped that when that happened she would give up on the flashing lights but she either puts up with the impulse noise or doesn't get any. Is it possible that her lights affect me but not her? It's also possible she hasn't twigged as to the source of the problem.
Is there anything that I can do other than ask my neighbour not to have the flashing lights on her tree? Anything that isn't going to cost me hundreds of dollars I mean.
Another thing that I would like to know is why such obviously flawed technology is being introduced. In all the commercials urging people get 'digital ready' nothing is said about impulse noise and the potentially exorbitant cost that many are going to have to bear in order to limit its effects.
I download alot of TV shows that are not screened in Australia and none of them show any evidence of impulse noise. Why is impulse noise such a problem in Australia but not overseas?

[Beaucoupnice]

Hi All,

I just returned to Perth, Western Australia and have brought over my LE26R88BD LCD HD Ready by Samsung which I bought in the UK.

I have been able to tune in the 5 local terrestrial channels but cannot tune in the digital channels.

The house I am in is a rental, so Im unsure what the aerial is.

The specifications of the tv are as per the following link.

http://www.dooyoo.co...6r88bd/details/

Can anyone offer some an advice to help me, as the kids need a distraction.!!

Thankyou very much in advance

Beau

[mtv]

Beau,

Looking at the specs on the model in your link, the TV only has an analogue tuner.

HD 'Ready' simply means you can connect an HD set top box to get screen resolution up to 1080i quality.

So to tune the digital channels, you will need to obtain & connect an HD set top box.

Beaucoupnice, on Dec 12 2010, 11:52 AM, said:

Hi All,

I just returned to Perth, Western Australia and have brought over my LE26R88BD LCD HD Ready by Samsung which I bought in the UK.

I have been able to tune in the 5 local terrestrial channels but cannot tune in the digital channels.

The house I am in is a rental, so Im unsure what the aerial is.

The specifications of the tv are as per the following link.

http://www.dooyoo.co...6r88bd/details/

Can anyone offer some an advice to help me, as the kids need a distraction.!!

Thankyou very much in advance

Beau

[Beaucoupnice]

mtv, on Dec 12 2010, 09:35 AM, said:

Beau,

Looking at the specs on the model in your link, the TV only has an analogue tuner.

HD 'Ready' simply means you can connect an HD set top box to get screen resolution up to 1080i quality.

So to tune the digital channels, you will need to obtain & connect an HD set top box.

Thanks for the reply Col. The only reason I thought it could get digital tv was because it has digital tv integrated into the unit. We were able to successfully tune in digital tv channels in the UK ( Freeview UK - over 40 channels ).

I dont suppose you or anyone here knows if the digital signal in Perth is different to the UK one.

At the top of the specs it shows this as being TV Tuner 1x analogue, 1x digital.

I just read manual it says

"Any functions related to Digital TV (DVB) will only work in countries or areas where DVB-T (MPEG2) digital terrestrial signals are broadcasted."

Is this the same as Perth.

Thanks again

[mtv]

Beau,

You're correct... it does say it had a digital and analogue tuner, but it only quotes specs for the analogue tuner (which is why I missed the digital bit up the top).

The term 'HD ready usually means it doesn't have an HD tuner, but is capable of displaying HD resolution, so from that, I would expect it's only a standard definition digital tuner.

Whilst Australia uses 7 MHz channel bandwidth MPEG2 DVB-T, the system is different to the UK, which uses an 8MHz channel bandwidth.

The UK uses UHF frequencies and Australia uses a mix of VHF and UHF, so if your TV has a UHF-only tuner, you won't be able to tune most of the Australian channels in Perth.

I'll download the TV manual & see if I can find more info on the digital specs for it.

EDIT: OK, looking at the manual hasn't helped much, as it doesn't state full specs.

I'd say if you can't select Australia in the counties list, it's not likely to be compatible for the Australian DVB-T standard.

I also found this under 'Previewing the DTV Menu System'  

"The company does not guarantee the normal

operation of the DTV menu for countries other than

the 6 supported countries (United Kingdom,

Germany, France, Italy, Spain, Austria) because only

these country standards are supported."

Edited by mtv, 12 December 2010 - 06:13 PM.

[M'bozo]

Beaucoupnice,

It's a Western Europe type set, so, if where you are in Perth, you are receiving digital channels on VHF, it may be able to tune these.

Try a "Plug & Play", set the country to Germany (I presume that's available as an option, otherwise choose any European country (except France), do an "Auto Store" and it might pick up at least digital 2,7,9 & 10.

If it doesn't, then you can try a "Manual Store" via the  "D.MENU" screen, and try tuning for the following channels, ensuring the "Bandwidth" is set to "7 MHz":



Channel 5 (177500 KHz), should come up as 7 network,

Channel 7 (191500 KHz), should come up as WIN/9*,

Channel 11 (219500 KHz), should come up as 10 network,

Channel 12 (226500 KHz), should come up as ABC.

As far as UHF channels, SBS & CTV are concerned, I reckon you'll get nada. If the above works, at least you'll have something.

If it doesn't, then a HD STB is the way to go.

Good luck.


*Yes I know it has an offset, the set should cope with this if it is going to work at all.

[Beaucoupnice]

M'bozo, on Dec 12 2010, 05:59 PM, said:

Beaucoupnice,

It's a Western Europe type set, so, if where you are in Perth, you are receiving digital channels on VHF, it may be able to tune these.

Try a "Plug & Play", set the country to Germany (I presume that's available as an option, otherwise choose any European country (except France), do an "Auto Store" and it might pick up at least digital 2,7,9 & 10.

If it doesn't, then you can try a "Manual Store" via the  "D.MENU" screen, and try tuning for the following channels, ensuring the "Bandwidth" is set to "7 MHz":



Channel 5 (177500 KHz), should come up as 7 network,

Channel 7 (191500 KHz), should come up as WIN/9*,

Channel 11 (219500 KHz), should come up as 10 network,

Channel 12 (226500 KHz), should come up as ABC.

As far as UHF channels, SBS & CTV are concerned, I reckon you'll get nada. If the above works, at least you'll have something.

If it doesn't, then a HD STB is the way to go.

Good luck.


*Yes I know it has an offset, the set should cope with this if it is going to work at all.

Gday lads,

Thanks so much for the help, your words of wisdom are golden.

I emailed Samsung a couple of days ago and they got back to me stating the following

"Samsung units are manufactured for specific countries.

Each country have different broadcasting formats as well as different frequencies that the stations broadcast
on. The voltage requirements for each country are also different and this may cause a fire hazzard if used in
other countries.

Please be careful as to the voltage requirements of your TV and that it meets the standards of Australia. To
check please look at the sticker on the back of your unit about voltage requirements.

As for able to get analogue channels and not digital channels, it is because Australia broadcast their digital
channels on a different range to the UK. You will be required to get a set top box to get digital channels. "

So I went out and bought a Bush HD Digital Set Top Box model number DFTA45R. It has successfully tuned in 16 digital channels.

For some reason though there are diagonal lines all over the screen making the reception poor. Its quite irritating. It seems to be from the aerial cable, because when I remove the aerial, the STB menu screen clears right up (of course there is no reception though . I tried a different cable and the same thing happened.

Any thoughts???

Thanks again.

[M'bozo]

Jarod63, on Dec 12 2010, 03:38 AM, said:

Hi. I hope this is in the right place.

It is.

Just seems like no one from "Australia's Leading Digital TV and AV forum" has a response for you.

[alanh]

Jarrod,
I did not see your post.
Downloaded video, unless it was recorded off air first will not have any of the problems of off air interference. However the quality is usually worse anyway.

Impulse noise gets weaker as the frequency rises, so UHF such as SBS and West TV is less affected than the VHF channels. This is why the ACMA has not allocated any TV transmitters to any RF channel below channel 6.

Do you have a masthead amplifier mounted in a box below the antenna, along with a plug pack which is fed into an inserter in the antenna feed between the receiver and the wall socket?

Essentially you do not have enough signals. Another cause is corrosion in the antenna, which is common in Craigie because of the high salt level in the air. This particularly makes reception of 9, GEM and Go! unreliable in impulse interference.

Look at the antenna drawings in the link Antenna basics in the first post in this strand. Post the antenna type you have from the drawings. You should also be able to see manufacturers' pictures in the H34, and H3, H4 links in the same first post in this strand.

The best way to reduce this interference is to get an electrician to put an 100 nF capacitor across the contacts of a flasher relay or the flashing bulb.. If LEDs are being used the capacitor can be placed across the output of the controller.

From your description you either have an antenna system fault or the antenna is not sensitive enough. Do you loose signal during heavy rain?

AlanH