75 replies to this topic

[:)]

good work jmone that is an absolute bargain. stevie B a gentleman too so a smooth transaction be happy with no doubt. While there are compromises with everything. using a white screen myself I am quite sure this is a lovely screen (its something most would be damn proud off) and with PJ of your choice you are going to be extremely pleased with a huge huge smile when fire things up

ps be sure to let us follow your story when set things up with a thread in the setup and construction subforum, we are all learning and am sure be something for us to all gain from your experience to come

[jmone]

On the PJ - at this stage I'm in the Epson 9000 camp due to my particular "no drill" installation requirement and the inclusion of the wireless HDMI bridge is a big WAF win for me. Lets see if I change my mind in the morning.

Thank you gentleman for your posts and patience (even if I have asked the same Q more than once). Also Owen I see you still like you LCOS tech (first that tweaked Sony of yours and now the JVC).

[Owen]

jmone, on 19 February 2012 - 08:46 PM, said:

Thanks gents, I like both Owen's summation of the technical and value concept yet as I'm dipping my toe into PJ land for the first time (and not sure how the WAF will go) feel the the cost position that Crist points out..... Anyway! I'm also going to follow the same path as all of you and start with what should be a good value white screen and take it from there as I've just purchased Stevie.B's 100" 16:9 Majestic screen http://www.dtvforum....showtopic=99770 !

I think your approach is the right one and the 100" Magestic came along at just the right time.
Once you have lived with a projection setup for a while you will be in a much better position to judge what you like and what you don't, you can then upgrade the screen and or projector as required.

Best of luck with the wife.

As for LCoS, I do like its "look" but the JVC was chosen because no other digital technology offered a native contrast ratio that was even close to high enough. I was looking to get black performance more like my old CRT setup, the JVC did not disappoint but I still want better blacks. Maybe a scanning laser projector will give me the infinite contrast I crave with no negative side effects. Not likely but I live in hope.
Existing projector and flat panel technology has not advanced significantly in the last few years, we need something completely new. At least projectors are much less compromised than flat panels.

The first time I ever saw a JVC projector was when I unpacked mine. If it did not live up to expectations it was going on Ebay, nothing ventured nothing gained.

Edited by Owen, 19 February 2012 - 10:40 PM.

[MRCRIST]

Owen, on 19 February 2012 - 08:12 PM, said:

How did you convince the wife to let you install black carpet and paints the ceiling black?  If you didn't the light from the kitchen is only part of the problem.

I didn't convice the wife because my room has light (Timber Ceilings) and a light coloured floor. The walls are natural tumbled brick with a motley of light colours. The room has a very warm ambience especially in winter with the wood fire blazing in the corner which incidentally is to the other side of the screen. So DNP screen  would be a waste of money for my situation.

[MRCRIST]

Congratulations mate you will love it. PS I am intrigued how your going to set up the 100" fixed frame projection screen given a no drill policy. also storing when not in use has it's own set of challenges. Best of luck and yes please post pics.

jmone, on 19 February 2012 - 08:53 PM, said:

On the PJ - at this stage I'm in the Epson 9000 camp due to my particular "no drill" installation requirement and the inclusion of the wireless HDMI bridge is a big WAF win for me. Lets see if I change my mind in the morning. Thank you gentleman for your posts and patience (even if I have asked the same Q more than once). Also Owen I see you still like you LCOS tech (first that tweaked Sony of yours and now the JVC).

Edited by Crist, 20 February 2012 - 10:14 AM.

[blybo]

I believe the no drill policy is for the HDMI through the ceiling, being the ground floor of a double story house. Similar situation to myself and I'm still kicking myself that I tried to save a few bucks and didn't wire up for 7.1

[jmone]

You right, it is only a year ago that we chased in the cabling for this room (was brick / concrete) then plastered / painted etc.  Did not even cross my mind about running HDMI from front to back....

[Owen]

Crist, on 20 February 2012 - 10:09 AM, said:

I didn't convice the wife because my room has light (Timber Ceilings) and a light coloured floor. The walls are natural tumbled brick with a motley of light colours. The room has a very warm ambience especially in winter with the wood fire blazing in the corner which incidentally is to the other side of the screen. So DNP screen  would be a waste of money for my situation.

You seem to misunderstand how these screens work.
Your room colouring is not unlike mine and it plays havoc with contrast. Even with that fire to the side of the screen the ambient light rejection screen will have MUCH better contrast than a white screen because the side lighting dramatically affects the light coming from the ceiling and floor. The improvement will be much greater than any projector upgrade could ever provide and the only way to get better performance would be to paint the whole room black.
The fancy screen also keeps the whole room much darker in bright scenes, thats definitely an advantage as far as I am concerned.

I know its easy to dismiss such products due to their cost but people buy white screens that are a similar price and spend more on A-lens's that do bugger all for picture quality.

Edited by Owen, 20 February 2012 - 06:25 PM.

[MRCRIST]

Owen, on 20 February 2012 - 06:13 PM, said:

You seem to misunderstand how these screens work.
Your room colouring is not unlike mine and it plays havoc with contrast. Even with that fire to the side of the screen the ambient light rejection screen will have MUCH better contrast than a white screen because the side lighting dramatically affects the light coming from the ceiling and floor. The improvement will be much greater than any projector upgrade could ever provide and the only way to get better performance would be to paint the whole room black.
The fancy screen also keeps the whole room much darker in bright scenes, thats definitely an advantage as far as I am concerned.

I know its easy to dismiss such products due to their cost but people buy white screens that are a similar price and spend more on A-lens's that do bugger all for picture quality.

I wish you didn't write that   you have stirred my desire once again  but I made a promise to kerb spending

[Owen]

Settle mate, if you do something financially irresponsible your lady will want to hunt me down and give me what for.

[SLE355]

Whats the cost of one of these screens V's a good white screen at around the 120" mark?

[chuna]

I am now deciding between these 2 projectors, the 9000 and the X30. Its funny reading this thread. All those owning the 9000 says thats better for obvious reasons and also to justify the purchase whilst saying its better because they saw a demo in a shop of the other and vice versa for the X30 owners. and most agreeing to disagree lol.. From all the net reviews the X30 seems to be winning in the reviews front saying it has the best 2D images in its class which 2D is what I am after anyway. Ill continue to read more reviews and more forums for more user feedbacks before plonking the cash...

[:)]

chuna, on 01 June 2012 - 12:16 PM, said:

I am now deciding between these 2 projectors, the 9000 and the X30. Its funny reading this thread. All those owning the 9000 says thats better for obvious reasons and also to justify the purchase whilst saying its better because they saw a demo in a shop of the other and vice versa for the X30 owners. and most agreeing to disagree lol.. From all the net reviews the X30 seems to be winning in the reviews front saying it has the best 2D images in its class which 2D is what I am after anyway. Ill continue to read more reviews and more forums for more user feedbacks before plonking the cash...

all you'll ever get from reviews and forums is some persons opinion, so shouldnt be surpised to read what you do in this thread. if planning to buy something the most informed decision can make is actually go check out and see for your self. soon cuts through all the bulldust you tend to have to read and wade through

[Quark]

If you've got full light control, the X30 is going to give a better 2D picture, but costs more.

Other considerations are JVC's 1 year warranty and atrociously slow support vs Epson's 3.5 year warranty (the 0.5 with registration) and mostly good/reasonable support.  Both brands have had more than their fair share of premature failures, so this is important.

The TW9000 is going to be a better option if you:
Want reasonable 3D performance.
Want a very large screen.
Don't have complete light control.
Want the comfort of decent warranty and support.
Have a stretched budget.

The X30 is going to be a better option if you:
Have complete light control and want the better 2D image.
Want to be able to zoom for 'scope.
Have the extra $.
Don't want a really huge screen.
Aren't too fussed about a decent warranty and timely support.

Edited by Quark, 01 June 2012 - 02:50 PM.

[chuna]

Quark, on 01 June 2012 - 12:56 PM, said:

Don't want a really huge screen.

How many inches are you talking about when you mean dont want a huge screen? 120" is that too huge or ok?

[chuna]

:), on 01 June 2012 - 12:27 PM, said:

all you'll ever get from reviews and forums is some persons opinion,

Yes but I think I can take an opinion with more credibility if someone had both of these or had one or the other at home at some stage which is rare I know but like you said its harder to believe a store that has both on demo cause they may be pushing one over the other due to profitability and the likes.

[:)]

chuna, on 01 June 2012 - 01:59 PM, said:

Yes but I think I can take an opinion with more credibility if someone had both of these or had one or the other at home at some stage which is rare I know but like you said its harder to believe a store that has both on demo cause they may be pushing one over the other due to profitability and the likes.

best can still do is actually go see for yourself.

there are stores that sell both. go look at them compare. best your going to get

its pretty rare anyone will have both projectors in their house to comment.

I for one take a bit more value of people having seen and experienced things to comment, and there are plenty whom have. Theres also real owners feedback which myself value rather than reviews or people going on their own theories and never even having seen the items in question.

at end of it from forums reviews etc still only going to get is opinion. where in end if buying something the only opinion actually matters is your very own

[chuna]

:), on 01 June 2012 - 02:18 PM, said:

Theres also real owners feedback which myself value rather than reviews

Agreed, although, if you yourself have an Epson 9000, you are obviously going to say its the best, you are not going to say the other unit is better are you? Thats why I said if someone owns one or the other they are only going to say nice things about it. But at the end of the day you are right it is only opinions and I am the only one who can go to a store and check it out myself and make an informed decision without being swayed by the sales person.

[Quark]

chuna, on 01 June 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

How many inches are you talking about when you mean dont want a huge screen? 120" is that too huge or ok?

You'll be fine with a 120" screen in a light controlled room if you keep the projector relatively close to the screen (brightness drops off as the projector gets further away) and/or go with a screen gain ~1.2.  See here if you want to run the numbers yourself.

[:)]

chuna, on 01 June 2012 - 02:44 PM, said:

Agreed, although, if you yourself have an Epson 9000, you are obviously going to say its the best, you are not going to say the other unit is better are you? Thats why I said if someone owns one or the other they are only going to say nice things about it. ~

not everyone is that shallow. some have a bit more perspective and integrity. but yes its only opinion which in itself is coloured by perception and in many cases very much dependant on context. which might not match yours....just keep in mind many might have gone through the same decision process as you are faced and if they articulate their reasons for their final choice. it can be of help ...

take anything you read as just as a heads up. you dont have to accept it. you dont have to agree with it. thats how I take forums and reviews etc. It brings things to my attention, highlight things, at times it might be all I need to make a gut feel decision. or better still as a result am better educated on various aspects of things which helps me when finally go check something out to make a more informed decision

chuna, on 01 June 2012 - 02:44 PM, said:

~ But at the end of the day you are right it is only opinions and I am the only one who can go to a store and check it out myself and make an informed decision without being swayed by the sales person.

bang o ....

[mmu16]

I have an X30 projecting onto a 140" OZTS evo 3D scope screen and the image is plenty bright (in a light controlled room).  As far as the X30 and TW9000 comparison is concerned, the epson beats the JVC in 3D. Hands down. However the 2D image of the JVC is to die for + lens memory function made me get the X30. Another factor is how quiet the JVC is compared to the Epson (personal preference). I'm planning on replacing this with an X70R pretty soon though

[bbar]

mmu16, on 04 June 2012 - 11:40 AM, said:

I have an X30 projecting onto a 140" OZTS evo 3D scope screen and the image is plenty bright (in a light controlled room).  As far as the X30 and TW9000 comparison is concerned, the epson beats the JVC in 3D. Hands down. However the 2D image of the JVC is to die for + lens memory function made me get the X30. Another factor is how quiet the JVC is compared to the Epson (personal preference). I'm planning on replacing this with an X70R pretty soon though

Would agree 100%, and as a thought (stolen from Owen), you may get more bang for buck if you get a Lumagen to do calibration rather than X70 unless you feel you can get the extra contrast in your environment.

[crumpet]

Another thing is contrary to what most have written here the JVC and the Epson are actually virtually identical in brightness when properly set up for video reproduction, both roughly 800 lumens in high lamp mode,
I would say the comparison is as follows

Brightness - Even in video , more versatility goes to epson if you dont care how it looks
Contrast - JVC- no contest im afraid, i've used both in the same room and in dark scenes the jvc is in a whole other league
Warranty - Epson 3 years , JVC suks with 1 year
Scope screen use - jvc no contest
Colour management - Epson as the jvc has no CMS.
3D - Epson wins here although the x30 is alot better than the x3 was , minimal flickering and ghosting from my tests
Noise Levels - JVC, much quieter

Overall 3D - Epson
Overall 2D - JVC

cheers
Rob

Edited by crumpet, 05 June 2012 - 10:32 AM.

[chuna]

After much thought I have got JVC. The nstll will be done when I get back from overseas and my main use is 2D. I dont cre really for 3D. More gimmicky than anything else and the JVC has a gorgeous 2D quality from what I saw in the demo which made me go that way which is whats important to me. I was told the JVC has a 2 year warranty but I put this on my platinum card so essentially will double my warranty anyhow. But I change technology with the times so doesnt really matter on too long a warranty for me. 2 yers is good enough for me.

[mmu16]

The new australian consumer protection laws effective 1 Jan 2012 should put your warranty concerns at ease anyway.  There are some threads about this matter so read up on it. +1 for crumpet's comments. after calibration both pj's will throw pretty much identical ftl - its just that the JVC does it much better