66 replies to this topic

[boater]

Just got an email from ICETV offering the new Humax 7500T with a perpetual ICETV subscription
See: http://www.icetv.com...DR7500T_1TB_PVR

Googling around I found this:
http://smarthouse.co...C4D9Q5L7?page=1

Its does look tempting, seeing to integrate rather well with ICETV (which I already have for my Topfield 5000)

But of course I am curious if anyone has any experience with these units before I lay down $650 for the unit plus a perpetual subscription

Regards

Richard
p.s. Checking the FAQ I see that it won't output HD over component - only HDMI. As I have a top-of-the-line Toshiba 36" CRT which does HD but does not have HDMI that rather wipes this unit out for me. Interestingly my PS3 will happily play blue-ray in HD over component on this TV - but according to ICETV the Humax 7500T is a HD PVR that only works as such over HDMI.
See: http://support.icetv...efinition-video

Bummer

Edited by boater, 24 August 2011 - 09:45 AM.

[diesel]

boater, on Aug 24 2011, 09:12 AM, said:

Just got an email from ICETV offering the new Humax 7500T with a perpetual ICETV subscription
See: http://www.icetv.com...DR7500T_1TB_PVR

Googling around I found this:
http://smarthouse.co...C4D9Q5L7?page=1

Its does look tempting, seeing to integrate rather well with ICETV (which I already have for my Topfield 5000)

But of course I am curious if anyone has any experience with these units before I lay down $650 for the unit plus a perpetual subscription

Regards

Richard
p.s. Checking the FAQ I see that it won't output HD over component - only HDMI. As I have a top-of-the-line Toshiba 36" CRT which does HD but does not have HDMI that rather wipes this unit out for me. Interestingly my PS3 will happily play blue-ray in HD over component on this TV - but according to ICETV the Humax 7500T is a HD PVR that only works as such over HDMI.

Hi Richard

This PVR looks very interesting and there is certainly a bit of 'marketing hype' around the Applesque interface. I too am curious to see what it looks like and how it goes - though I am waiting for the new beyonwiz model to come out early next year before I will buy another PVR.
The two things I do like about the PVR is it comes with 24 month manufacturers warranty and for only $99, you can add lifetime IceTV subscription....a very good deal IMO. It seems to have all the 'me too' features of my near +4year old Wizzes or is that Wizii????  

As for the HDMI over component thing, I believe that as of 2011, all devices sold with HDMI and component are no longer permitted to output HD over component as part of having HDMI connection onboard. I believe it's one of the licensing requirements for HDMI. The reason your PS3 can do it, is it probably predates this change in licensing.

[pgdownload]

Looks like an interesting box. Also interesting that ICE are trying out a new subscription model - presumably Humax pay ICETV a set licence fee for every PVR they sell.

The manuals are very well laid out, the GUI looks polished and the remote looks nice - encouraging.

Here is the manual. Some things I gleaned:

• This PVR will only output HD content over the HDMI cable. All other outputs will be down converted to 576i.
  
• Its a bit confusing as to if the unit can display as 1080p. Theoretically yes, but seemingly only if the original source is 1080p (i.e. it will only up convert to 1080i max). As the unit won't play MKVs and broadcasts are only ever 1080i max then the answer is no.
  
• The unit setup is Oz specific and you enter your state (suggesting but not confirming it may handle DLS)
  
• Unit comes with a wireless dongle. Plays media files direct via USB or has a DLNA server to stream from a NAS.
  
• Has Teletext and Subtitles
  
• Has five nameable favourite groups for channels
  
• Has references to being able to set series record from the EPG itself. It would be interesting to see if this used some sort of ICE SERIES ID or actually updated the ICETV settings. The later would be a first for ICETV and pretty cool. In the end either approach would probably be just as effective
  
• User adjustable automatic start and end padding for timers.
  
• Configurable skip back button 7,15, 30 seconds and skip forward button 30, 60, 120, 240 seconds.
  
• Automatic 120 min Timeshift buffer
  
• Resume Play from where you left off.
  
• Ability to copy recordings to an external USB drive.
  
• A rudimentary media player (only does MP3, JPG and AVI)
  
• Apparently has a small cooling fan.
  
• No PiP.
  
• Supports YouTube, iView (ABC) WikiTV and Picassa.
  
• 24 Months Manufacturers Warranty

No idea on reliability, but given the Humax brand and the ICETV affiliation I'd be surprised if it didn't work as advertised. Assuming an HDMI cable the only negatives would be just the two ad skip buttons and no MKV support. At $650 (incl. Lifetime ICETV) its fairly pricey. A Tivo for $500 would give much the same functionality (Replaces the ad skip buttons with a very good x32 FF)

Regards

Peter Gillespie

Edited by pgdownload, 24 August 2011 - 10:35 AM.

[boater]

diesel, on Aug 24 2011, 10:07 AM, said:

As for the HDMI over component thing, I believe that as of 2011, all devices sold with HDMI and component are no longer permitted to output HD over component as part of having HDMI connection onboard. I believe it's one of the licensing requirements for HDMI. The reason your PS3 can do it, is it probably predates this change in licensing.

Sigh - forced obsolescence strikes again.

So I would need one of these as well:
http://www.jaycar.co...w.asp?ID=AC1605

[boater]

pgdownload, on Aug 24 2011, 10:31 AM, said:

No idea on reliability, but given the Humax brand and the ICETV affiliation I'd be surprised if it didn't work as advertised. Assuming an HDMI cable the only negatives would be just the two ad skip buttons and no MKV support. At $650 (incl. Lifetime ICETV) its fairly pricey. A Tivo for $500 would give much the same functionality (Replaces the ad skip buttons with a very good x32 FF)

Regards

Peter Gillespie

Thanks for the link to the manual

$650 for the 1 tb with lifetime ICETV
$550 for 500 GB with lifetime ICETV (this is a better comparison with the Tivo at 320 GB I think)

So $50 extra for for the Humax 500 GB with ICETV vs TiVo, and $50 less for the Humax vs TiVo if you want to transfer files (p61 of the manual says you can share the HDD and/or set it up as a FTP server out-of-the-box) as Tivo is an extra $99 for file transfer I think.

Interestingly I see on p60 that is can read/write to ext3 and FAT as well as read NTFS.

Does the current Oz TiVo do HD over component?

Richard

[stomick]

Hi all,

I've been looking at replacing my old Humax SMART with the Topfield TRF-2460 from IceTV until this morning's email arrived...

My gripes with the SMART include:
• the poor local support from Humax in terms of firmware updates
• remote control conflict of SMART channel up + Yamaha receiver volume
• inability to use chase play (which was activated in an update for UK models, I believe, but not for the Oz model)
• cumbersome keyboard control when editing recording names

Looks like the 7500T sorts out the last two of these issues for me (a big selling point for the wife will be the SMS style keyboard input), but I am worried that firmware updates might be as infrequent and dissapointing as they were for the SMART...

Does anyone know if a TAP is available to give the Topfield SMS text entry abilities?  A google found this UK Oz Archive TAP which apparently replaces the existing file list interface and allows you to edit recording names with SMS style text entry, but would this play nicely with an IceTV activated TRF-2460?

If not, then along with the perpetual Ice subscription, I might be tempted to stick with Humax and hope their support improves... (damn - I have said for ages I would never buy another Humax product!)

By the way, it looks as though the TRF-2460 has the same HDMI / Component limitation - not a problem for me as I'm looking to upgrade the telly as well!

Stomick

Edited by stomick, 24 August 2011 - 11:43 AM.

[pgdownload]

boater, on Aug 24 2011, 10:50 AM, said:

$550 for 500 GB with lifetime ICETV (this is a better comparison with the Tivo at 320 GB I think)Does the current Oz TiVo do HD over component?

Didn't see the 500Gb option. So yes both units pretty close. You'd have to confirm but I believe the Tivo does HD over component. However I believe it does restrict offloading files to a PC to SD.

Personally I'd probably buy the 500Gb unit as you can always offload files if really needed to an external USB.

I can't speak for FW support however as mentioned the unit looks like some effort and thought has gone into it. I'd be hoping that out of the box it essentially works as advertised (PVRs manufacturers have come a long way from there earlier efforts that basically needed updates to fix ongoing issues.)

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[CarlR]

stomick, on Aug 24 2011, 11:34 AM, said:

Does anyone know if a TAP is available to give the Topfield SMS text entry abilities?  A google found this UK Oz Archive TAP which apparently replaces the existing file list interface and allows you to edit recording names with SMS style text entry, but would this play nicely with an IceTV activated TRF-2460?

I see no reason why it wouldn't work.

Quote

it looks as though the TRF-2460 has the same HDMI / Component limitation - not a problem for me as I'm looking to upgrade the telly as well!

No. The 576 resolution cap is only for the Component Input, not the Component Output.

[Paul55]

diesel, on Aug 24 2011, 10:07 AM, said:

for only $99, you can add lifetime IceTV subscription....a very good deal IMO.

Sort of.....
The lifetime subscription only applies to one Humax box. If you buy another, it will require its own subscription.
Also doesn't apply to any current account - i.e. it won't extend the life of your current subscription.

Not bad, but not as attractive as it looked at first glance.

[glow]

The manual p57 suggested checking the Humax website http://www.humaxdigital.com/au for the latest news but that link didn't work.
Instead I had a look at http://www.humaxdigital.com.au/ and found that they are selling the 500GB for $399 and 1TB for $499

[stomick]

CarlR, on Aug 24 2011, 12:59 PM, said:

No. The 576 resolution cap is only for the Component Input, not the Component Output.

Ah... my bad.  Sorry - misread that in the manual.  Thanks.

[diesel]

boater, on Aug 24 2011, 10:33 AM, said:

Sigh - forced obsolescence strikes again.

So I would need one of these as well:
http://www.jaycar.co...w.asp?ID=AC1605

Oh one of these - link

[boater]

diesel, on Aug 24 2011, 10:53 PM, said:

Oh one of these - link

Thanks but no thanks.

I already have a fabulous TV which does HD, has no scalability problems with SD and is a good fit for my TV room.

Just because someone is trying to 'restrict trade' by saying if you want to use our technology then your not allowed to use this other technology.

One thing I am wondering is if this is a HDMI issue or a Blue-ray issues. The discussion I have seen so far does not make this clear.

See: http://arstechnica.c...analog-hole.ars

Richard

[pgdownload]

glow, on Aug 24 2011, 01:56 PM, said:

Instead I had a look at http://www.humaxdigital.com.au/ and found that they are selling the 500GB for $399 and 1TB for $499

I'd confirm the ICETV deal could be applied to these PVRs. I'd suspect ICETV are only offering it on units they sell.

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[diesel]

boater, on Aug 25 2011, 10:04 AM, said:

One thing I am wondering is if this is a HDMI issue or a Blue-ray issues. The discussion I have seen so far does not make this clear.

See: http://arstechnica.c...analog-hole.ars

Good question. The article you linked seems to indicate it's just a bluray thing, but I wonder if any digital content player (eg media player, PVR, video camera) that is equipped with HDMI output is also hamstrung by this change in licensing???
After all, they are also able to output HD video.  

[Mantorok]

I'd like to know how clever this Humax PVR is with its tuner usage.  eg.  If recording 2 shows at the same time, one on 7two and the other on 7mate say, will only one tuner be in use allowing you to watch any other channel you like?

Also, can it do quad recording like the Toppy 24x0?

And finally how does it handle consecutive timers on the same channel (ie. LCN). Does it just stop the first recording and then start the next...leaving a few seconds gap between them.  Or is it smart enough to continue the first recording while starting the second (on the same or other tuner).  I've yet to find a dual tuner PVR that can handle this.

Shame it only supports Xvid videos (plus its own recordings).

Otherwise it looks like a nice unit.

Edited by Mantorok, 25 August 2011 - 01:08 PM.

[rpant]

glow, on Aug 24 2011, 01:56 PM, said:

Instead I had a look at http://www.humaxdigital.com.au/ and found that they are selling the 500GB for $399 and 1TB for $499

Where exactly on their webpage did you see it for those prices? All I can find is $449 and $549.

Also, I'm probably going to check one of these out at Sciteq Wangara tomorrow. Apparently they have a demo unit on display.
If anyone has any questions about it let me know and I'll see if I can get an answer.

[pgdownload]

Mantorok, on Aug 25 2011, 12:57 PM, said:

I'd like to know how clever this Humax PVR is with its tuner usage.  eg.  If recording 2 shows at the same time, one on 7two and the other on 7mate say, will only one tuner be in use allowing you to watch any other channel you like?

I'd be very surprised if it couldn't do this.

Quote

Also, can it do quad recording like the Toppy 24x0?

As its not mentioned I be almost certain No.

Quote

And finally how does it handle consecutive timers on the same channel (ie. LCN).

You've probably answered your own question. However something for the in store test perhaps?

Regards

Peter gillespie

Edited by pgdownload, 25 August 2011 - 08:12 PM.

[brad5505]

pgdownload, on Aug 25 2011, 09:12 PM, said:

I'd be very surprised if it couldn't do this.
As its not mentioned I be almost certain No.
You've probably answered your own question. However something for the in store test perhaps?

Regards

Peter gillespie

The Magic TV MTV4000 can record 2 consecutive programs each with padding on the same channel (7 and 7TWO), and also record 2 consecutive programs on a different channel (10 and 11) at the same time. Apparently, the MTV doesn't overlap it's recordings. It stores the overlapping period as a separate file, ie: For two consecutive programmes on the same channel you end up with three files on the HDD. Found this information out on the New Zealand site

http://www.geekzone....m...&page_no=54

And tested myself with my MTV4000

Brad

[Mantorok]

brad5505, on Aug 25 2011, 09:06 PM, said:

The Magic TV MTV4000 can record 2 consecutive programs each with padding on the same channel (7 and 7TWO), and also record 2 consecutive programs on a different channel (10 and 11) at the same time. Apparently, the MTV doesn't overlap it's recordings. It stores the overlapping period as a separate file, ie: For two consecutive programmes on the same channel you end up with three files on the HDD. Found this information out on the New Zealand site

http://www.geekzone....m...&page_no=54

And tested myself with my MTV4000

How come a cheap $300 PVR can get this right but the high end ones like Beyonwiz and Topfield can't?  

If only the MTV4000 supported IceTV I'd get one for sure.

[glow]

rpant, on Aug 25 2011, 08:00 PM, said:

Where exactly on their webpage did you see it for those prices? All I can find is $449 and $549.

Also, I'm probably going to check one of these out at Sciteq Wangara tomorrow. Apparently they have a demo unit on display.
If anyone has any questions about it let me know and I'll see if I can get an answer.

Well indeed the prices have changed. I guess you could ask them how come the price jumped overnight.
Maybe they still have the old price on the boxes?

[pgdownload]

Mantorok, on Aug 26 2011, 08:24 AM, said:

How come a cheap $300 PVR can get this right but the high end ones like Beyonwiz and Topfield can't?

Not sure I describe making a third bridging file as "getting it right". I suspect it is a universal limitation with the broadcast format and how tuners have been designed to handle assigning and switching signal streams in mid course. I'd suspect trying to juggle this comprehensively possibly just results in corrupted files.

Regards

Peter Gillespie

[Mantorok]

pgdownload, on Aug 26 2011, 09:39 AM, said:

Not sure I describe making a third bridging file as "getting it right". I suspect it is a universal limitation with the broadcast format and how tuners have been designed to handle assigning and switching signal streams in mid course. I'd suspect trying to juggle this comprehensively possibly just results in corrupted files.

My bad.  I misread how the MagicTV handled it.  At least it makes an effort I guess.

I have a 5 year old PC running Windows XP and WebScheduler that handles consecutive recordings perfectly.  Is it too much to ask a modern PVR to do the same?

Edited by Mantorok, 26 August 2011 - 04:44 PM.

[rpant]

I went today and had a look at one of these at Sciteq Wangara.

Overall I quite liked the unit. Here's a few pros and cons from what I can remember.

PROS:

- Costs $399 for 500GB unit even though the web site states $449.
- Stays nice and cool/luke warm to the touch.
- Circular light around the power button changes colour for different functions:  Orange when in standby (no display on front panel), Red when recording, Blue all other times.
- Remote control looked and worked well, but some buttons could have been bigger.
- Rear and front USB sockets.
- Menu displays look nice and easy to read.
- Has timer padding.
- Has audio sync function in the menu.
- Fast Forward and rewind reasonably smooth and responsive with a max speed of 32x. (Topfield are better)
- Has chase play. (previous Aust Humax PVR didn't)
- EPG was easy to use and read. Seems to populate reasonably fast from what I saw.
- When setting recording in the EPG, first enter button press brings up options of Series record, Single record or Reminder.
- Single button press to get to recordings list.  When a recording is selected you then chose to resume playback, restart playback or delete, and some other functions I can't remember..
- Can continue to play files etc while copying to USB drive.
- You can review past EPG data. Not sure how far back you can go, I only tried a few hours.


CONS:

- When fast forwarding or rewinding a progress bar appears, but it stays onscreen for 30 seconds before it disappears. You can press exit if you don't want to wait.
- Timer padding only goes to 20 minutes max and you can only set it to a few preselected times. eg. 3 min, 5 min, 10 min, 20 min (from memory).
- Wireless dongle sold separately. I didn't ask the price.
- Red front display harder to read than other colours.
- No apprarent progress indicator when copying to usb drive.
- Some functions seem to be slowed down a lot while copying is in progress, although playback functions seemed normal.
- When recording 2 consecutive programs via the EPG, the second program starts recording before the first has finished, even though no padding was set.  I'm not sure how long but seemed like a couple of minutes. Therefore when the second recording starts both tuners are in use until the first recording ends. Conversly, when I tried recording channels 1 and 10 from the EPG at the same time, it seemed to only use one tuner so you could watch another channel but not record another channel.
- Recordings copied to USB drive won't play back on my PC. Drive looks like it's reading data but I get no picture or sound in any media player I've tried so far.
- Panning was quite jerky and sometimes the picture looked extremely interlaced. Was connected via HDMI 1080i. I don't know if this was caused by the TV or the PVR. TV was a Samsung LCD. Model unknown.



I'll add more to these lists if and when I remember something else.

Edited by rpant, 26 August 2011 - 07:37 PM.

[diesel]

Mantorok, on Aug 26 2011, 10:10 AM, said:

I have a 5 year old PC running Windows XP and WebScheduler that handles consecutive recordings perfectly.  Is it too much to ask a modern PVR to do the same?

Your PC has still got far more processing power than these PVRs would ever dream of. But it's not the processing power that is the issue, its the software running it.