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Dtv Reception Issues In Sydney


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#1 keioffice

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 03:47 PM

Hi guys

Would like some help here I've been having major issues with this DTV tuner I've purchased (for my car), everyone (or most at least) seem to be able to pick up all channels or at least a majority of them.

My issue is that I can't pick up anything except TVS and SBS HD (2-3 of them) but no 7, 9, 11 etc.

The antennas pick up TVS/SBS pretty fast, I had a look at some other earlier threads and found that smaller antennas pick up UHF(i think?) signals easier and you need larger ones to pick up the others.. I cant pick anything except TVS/SBS even when I'm stationary on the road in front of my house..

The thing is, majority (probably 90% as an estimate) of people who use the same system get all channels and they are in Sydney, Melbourne, Adel and Brisbane.. my house has no issues with reception in the area.

I've placed one on the right side rear windscreen and one on the left side passenger side front windscreen..

I really dont know what to do as and its really frustrating as I'm not sure what options I have. I have measured the voltage at the connectors for the antennas and they are indeed powered with 12-13.7V but sitll not able to pick up a signal.

Does anyone have any ideas at all or suggestions on who I can get to look at it??

Here are the antennas for reference, they are the exact same ones as pictured:
Posted Image

#2 alanh

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 07:27 PM

keioffice,
One post is enough.
The main transmitters in all state capital cities are all Band 3 VHF. Currently only SBS and TSN use band 4 UHF. There are some UHF translators covering Kings Cross, Manly/Mosman and the Northern beaches use UHF also.

The antenna above is only long enough for UHF. For the channels you wish to receive you need an antenna which is around 745 mm long from tip to tip. An amplifier cannot make up for an absence of signal.

You need a telescopic antenna instead.
AlanH

#3 keioffice

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 08:19 PM

thanks for your prompt reply.. i apologize as i am just frustrated unable to figure it out for a good 2 months now

my main driver was that, i just cant understand how other users of this DVB-T unit with same antennas seem to pick up signals in cities such as Adelaide and Melbourne..

when you say telescopic, did you mean the older style ones?

is it a design factor that only telescopic ones are able to pick up VHF?

i guess something like this -> http://www.hitv.com....d=18&category=2

i was told this works via 5V through the F connector however i tested with a multimeter but cant seem to find any voltage coming out of it. will this hinder the performance of the reception?

when you advise that length, that would mean something like this is out of the question - link ?

#4 mtv

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Posted 10 January 2012 - 11:12 PM

I'm puzzled how you know so many people who use the same system in Sydney, Melbourne, Adelaide and Brisbane.

If they are successful using an antenna not designed to work with VHF channels, why not ask them how they get it to work?

If you are close enough to the main transmitters, it may pick up signal, however, Sydney can be extremely variable with digital TV signals, even with a high-gain fixed antenna on a roof... many people have reception difficulties.

Given the antenna in your pic is amplified, it may even be overloading the tuner.

Without accurate signal measurements, it's impossible to tell what it's doing.

All you have shown is the antenna... what receiver are you using?.... Is it even designed to receive VHF frequencies @ 7MHz bandwidth (The Australian DVB-T standard)?

The DVB-T system is not designed for mobile reception.

#5 alanh

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 02:47 AM

keioffice,
In Sydney the only areas with UHF translators are Kings Cross, Manly/Mosman, Bouddi (Northern Beaches)
Melbourne: South Yarra, Dandenong Ranges, Safety Beach, Lorne
Adelaide: Adelaide Foothills, Craigmore/Hillbank

In all State Capitals The digital transmitters for the commercial stations and the ABC are on channels 6 - 12.
The receiver is fine unless it is only designed for UK only.

As for the link to another antenna, it looks like another UHF antenna. These are suitable in the UK where there is no VHF TV. UHF is very common in the USA and Europe.
You need to find out from the sell what the total length of the straight section is. Unless it's around 750 mm it is designed for band 3 which will be ok, but if its around 230 mm its for UHF.

http://www.kingray.n...and-amfm/AE2000 This antenna will work in all directions so when you turn a corner you don't loose the signal.

I also suggest you search this site with the word "Mobile" particularly in the Antenna strand. Others have posted in this forum on this topic.

AlanH

#6 keioffice

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 08:04 AM

thanks guys, got it. i'm really trying to find an antenna that will be thin or less noticable to put into the car..

heres details of the tuner: link

Specification:

  • Input frequency: VHF 177.5MHz - 226.5MHzUHF 474MHz - 858MHz
  • Modulate: QPSK/16 - QAM/64-QAM
  • Decode standard: MPEG2,MP@ML,MP@HL,H.264/AVC
  • Audio decode standard: MPEG-1, MPEG-2,layer and 2, MPEG-4, HE-AAC
  • 3 Way Video Output: Output Resistance: 75 ohm

Output Voltage: 1.0 +/_ 2.0mVp-p, Audio output: 2Vp-p


my assumption was through the original thread, the unit sold plenty and there were distributors in various capital cities but no one complained of reception issues which what drove me to buy a unit myself..



#7 mr 32

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 11:31 AM

there are some shark fin desgned ones that work well on cars but not really hidden

#8 alanh

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 01:09 PM

keioffice,
As I said the tuner is fine. It receives 7 MHz wide UHF channels which is unique to Australia.

The shark fin style are really UHF antennas due to their size.

I note that stretched limos use a boomerang style antenna which is large enough to work. Worth a try

AlanH

#9 mtv

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 03:34 PM

Your link isn't working, but if this
http://www.ebay.com....=item2c61c011c4 is your item, it uses two diversity antennas and shows where they should me mounted..... both on the rear window.

Keep in mind demister wires and window tint (especially metallic) may severly affect performance.

Whilst the tuner may be designed for both VHF and UHF, the antennas will perform best at UHF frequencies, due to their design, as evidenced by your UHF reception of the UHF channels.

Using amplification to attempt to compensate for poor performance generally doesn't work.

Where in Sydney are you?

#10 keioffice

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 03:49 PM

Thanks again guys

are there any antennas that use the f connector, VHF telescopic for car use and also have the ability to be powered/amplified?

im near liverpool around cumberland highway

#11 mtv

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Posted 11 January 2012 - 09:03 PM

Thanks again guys

are there any antennas that use the f connector, VHF telescopic for car use and also have the ability to be powered/amplified?

im near liverpool around cumberland highway


Possibly something like this: http://www.ebay.com....=item20b414d13b which has longer elements, closer to what's required for VHF.
You would need to adapt/change the connectors to F type.

Have you tried reception closer to Kings Cross and the north shore?

Have you tried connecting a home roof-mounted antenna designed for the digital channels?

Personally, I wouldn't waste money on it as results will be extremely variable, even if you used a full-sized digital antenna on your vehicle.. but, each to his own. :)

#12 keioffice

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Posted 13 January 2012 - 09:14 AM

it was suggested that i locate a TV tower and try tuning it in front of that to see what results i can get.

is there any value in doing that before i look into antennas as a last resort?

#13 alanh

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Posted 13 January 2012 - 12:44 PM

keioffice,
The receiver is working fine
You need a band 3 VHF antenna for the greater Sydney area.
If you go towards Wollongong, the high powered Illawarra transmitters are on UHF and can be received by you.
For transmitter details see the Transmitter link in http://www.dtvforum....showtopic=11690

Alanh

#14 mtv

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Posted 13 January 2012 - 10:25 PM

it was suggested that i locate a TV tower and try tuning it in front of that to see what results i can get.

is there any value in doing that before i look into antennas as a last resort?


Signals directly in front/below a transmission tower can actually be low, as the antennas are very high on the tower and radiating right over the top of you... not down.

I don't see how alanh can determine your receiver is working fine if you haven't managed to get anything on VHF yet.

Chances are it is, but emphatically stating it is with no evidence of fact is just typical of his arrogant manner.

If you get good Sydney digital TV reception on the VHF channels in your home, connect the receiver to your home antenna.

If it works, it proves your issue is antenna related. If it doesn't work, then it's a problem with the receiver.

Look at this in another perspective.... if those little car antennas worked like sellers suggest they do, we should all be able to use tiny antennas in our homes, but in reality, most of us need to use much larger directional antennas mounted on our roofs.

#15 keioffice

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Posted 14 January 2012 - 09:22 AM

got it, understood

to be honest i'd like to try the antennas but am having a hard time finding long telescopic ones that are for the F connector types.. i'm far from good with electronics and would like to avoid modifying or adapting plugs for F connectors..

are there any readily available online? i spent about an hour looking on ebay but to no luck..

#16 alanh

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Posted 14 January 2012 - 01:19 PM

Keioffice,
You can buy PAL to F converter plugs for a few dollars

AlanH

#17 mtv

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Posted 14 January 2012 - 02:00 PM

The standard TV connector used for most TV's etc in Australia is PAL, whilst most antennas, splitters, amps etc, now use F connectors, which are standard for satellite decoders, etc.

As mentioned, there are PAL/F adaptors available.

Lacey's TV have them and they would be fairly close to your location.

1/18 Alfred Rd, Chipping Norton

Jaycar and DSE are other possible suppliers.

#18 keioffice

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 11:59 AM

hi guys

still having issues as laceys werent able to assist me.

Ive just resorted to looking for more antennas on ebay..

ive found stick type ones..
http://www.ebay.com....#ht_3326wt_1209
http://www.ebay.com....#ht_4091wt_1107
http://www.ebay.com....#ht_1678wt_1209

and metal element ones
http://www.ebay.com....#ht_4546wt_1107
http://www.ebay.com....9#ht_6060wt_982
http://www.ebay.com....#ht_4679wt_1209
http://www.ebay.com....#ht_4293wt_1140
http://www.ebay.com....3a6ee5e20#ht_46

also saw this one which has long elements but wont suit f plugs -> i called the guy but he said its only for analogue and not digital tvs?
http://www.ebay.com....#ht_3001wt_1209

im really confused now..

could someone help me make a decision on what to purchase?

#19 alanh

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 05:02 PM

keioffice
http://www.dtvforum....opic=11367&st=0 Determine your required band and then click on the link of Indoor antennas.

AlanH

#20 mtv

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 05:46 PM

keioffice
http://www.dtvforum....opic=11367&st=0 Determine your required band and then click on the link of Indoor antennas.

AlanH


I don't see any antennas in your 'indoor antennas' section specifically for use on a car.. which is what this thread has been all about.

#21 mtv

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 05:49 PM

hi guys

still having issues as laceys werent able to assist me.


What?... Laceys couldn't help you with PAL/F adaptors?

I find that very difficult to believe as I've been buying them from Lacey's for years.

#22 keioffice

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 06:40 PM

yeh they said i should go to a marine/boating place after telling them my situation

i think it might be easier buying antennas from the ones i listed

what do you guys think?

Edited by keioffice, 31 January 2012 - 06:40 PM.


#23 mtv

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Posted 31 January 2012 - 06:54 PM

yeh they said i should go to a marine/boating place after telling them my situation

i think it might be easier buying antennas from the ones i listed

what do you guys think?


Sounds like to me you didn't specifically ask for the PAL/F adaptors, but asked for an antenna to suit your car?

If that's the case... they don't sell them.

The boating/marine antennas are generally large circular 'discs'.

You haven't confirmed that the VHF side of your car tuner works.... either in a stronger signal area, or by connecting to your home TV antenna.

There's little point continuing to seek advice, if you don't follow it when it's given.

If you really want to know how any antenna on your vehicle is performing, you need to have it tested with a digital signal meter/spectrum analyser.

No offense, but I still think you're wasting your time and money hoping to get reliable digital TV reception in your car with the antennas you are considering and the area you are in.

#24 keioffice

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Posted 01 February 2012 - 06:42 AM

no i understand where you're coming from, ur right and have very valid points

its all new to me and im unsure where to go to get a service like that i.e. get someone to test it. i asked lacey's but they only sell products and dont provide testing and such

are you able to point me in a direction or someone who is mobile?

Edited by keioffice, 01 February 2012 - 06:43 AM.


#25 alanh

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Posted 01 February 2012 - 11:26 PM

Col,
There is also a link to mobile antennas which has bee there for years.

AlanH