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Help With Abc Reception - Pascoe Vale Melbourne


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#1 doo

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 11:08 AM

Hope someone can help...

 

Have always had problems with ABC reception - pixilation and sometimes total drop out.

 

Got advice on this forum a long time ago (tried to search for it but couldn't find it)

 

I have a Hills antenna - not sure which one - and was advised to install a Kingray FL3BPMH filter to try and filter out any interference - it seemed to work and ABC was better....

 

However, not sure exactly when but ABC reception has got worse...

 

In doing some investigation it seems that ABC moved to  channel 12 (couldn't find out when?) and some older antennas may not work for channel 12.

 

How do I work out if my antenna is OK for channel 12 or not?

 

I can get ABC, but almost always with some pixilation and sometimes to the point where it is unwatchable - so wondering if my antenna is suitable for 12 or not?

 

Would I be able to get ABC at all - with bad reception - if my antenna was no good for 12?

 

Trying to work out where to start......

 

Is there somewhere I can find pictures of old antennas and try to work out what I have?

 

Thanks for any help....

 

Dooboy



#2 harold

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 11:34 AM

why not post a pic of what you have and someone here will probably know?



#3 doo

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 12:14 PM

Harold

 

Would love to post pics - have spent 30 minutes trying to figure out how to post a picture and failed!!!!

 

If someone can point me in the right direction so I can post a pic that woukld be great!!

 

 

Cheers

 

Dooboy



#4 alanh

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 01:10 PM

Doo,

Firstly put your exact address into http://myswitch.digitalready.gov.au/ to find out if you are in a poor signal area. If I recall there are some deep valleys in your suburb.

 

The ABC transmits its digital signal on channel 12 and antennas which are over 2 m wide at the back and not 740 mm are probably not designed for channel 12.

 

Do you watch channel 31 community TV?

 

If not you are better off with an band 3 only antenna where the whole antenna is used to receive the signal. Those with VHF and UHF will only use the UHF section for channel "31"

 

Let me know the colour of the map at your place and the answer to the above question before proceeding

 

Alanh



#5 doo

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 04:55 PM

Alanh

 

Thanks - I couldn't find the posts from a number of years ago but I remember your name and it was you who advised me to install the Kingray FL3BPMH filter.

 

From Myswitch I am in a good signal area - there are valleys near me but I am at the top of a hill and on the transmitter side of the valley (38.2 km from Melbourne transmitter)

 

While we do get C31 we don't ever watch it, so no issue not getting it.

 

Injured my leg on the weekend so a bit dicey climbing up to measure the antenna atm - but from ground level it looks to be 2M or wider at the back (tip to tip) - I know it is a Hills but can't remember which model and can't see a match when I look at Hills antennas on their web site. I took some pics today but can't figure out how to post them here....

 

If it is not designed for Ch12 would I even get the bad picture I am getting or nothing at all?

 

 

Doo



#6 alanh

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 09:04 PM

Doo,

http://www.hillsante...15&ProductID=52 is designed to cover channels 6 - 12 only so the whole antenna is active regardless of which channel you watch.

 

As to insensitivity to channel 12 depends on how strong the signal is and how long the cable to the TV is and if there is any corrosion in the antenna. You may find that channels, 7, 9 and SBS are rock solid reliability with the ABC and possibly TEN dropping out in rainy weather.

 

Alanh


Edited by alanh, 11 August 2014 - 09:06 PM.


#7 Ron12

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 10:50 PM

Hi Doo,

 

If you have an antenna suitable for Melbourne analog TV (i.e. not designed to receive channel 12) it doesn't mean no reception of a signal at all.  The signal on channel 12 would probably be inferior to other channels.  Due to the properties of digial TV, this could mean having just as good a picture as other channels, having some pixellation or signal loss, having lots of pixellation or signal loss, or not receiving the ABC at all. It all depends on how strong the received signal is and what the signal quality is like.

 

The only way to know for sure would be to get an installer to use a signal meter at the antenna output.  Other than that, if your TV can display signal strength and quality for each channel then this would give you an idea, but doesn't rule out problems elsewhere.

 

With my previous antenna (not designed for ch12), a fault meant that all my VHF channels had a lower signal strength than they should have.  This didn't affect the 7&9 digital (ch6 & ch8), as the signal quality was still good, but the ABC on ch12 would usually disappear or pixelate in the afternoon, and TEN Ch11 would do so occasionally.

 

Replacing the antenna with one designed for digital TV fixed the problem.

 

However, unlike Alanh I think that a VHF/UFH antenna would do the job well enough.  That's just my gut instinct, I'm not an installer.  If I were you I'd get an installer to look at your problem.



#8 doo

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 10:05 AM

Thanks guys

 

I have signal strength on TV and also on Tivo - I used Tivo as it displays the meter over the channel being viewed and is easy to change channels and see the strength. (and it looked like it gave the same result as the TV for ABC)

 

I believe the numbers are 0 to 100 for strength

 

ABC shows as 59 - has some pixilation and drop outs

 

Next worst is Channel 10 - at 81 but picture is fine

 

The others are 82(9) 99(7) 93(SBS)

 

So ABC signal is low and it may be that the antenna is not suited to Ch12 - but I would like to try and confirm it before I install a new antenna in case what I have should be OK and there is another issue somewhere? (wish I could post a picture!) It looks a bit like the OMX400 on the Hills Website but only has 7 of the narrow elelents (5 before the first wider one and 2 after it)

 

Looking in the direction the antenna points there is a school with some large gum trees about 100 meters away and the trees while not "dense" are in the line of sight so this may be causing problems - would it impact ABC more than other channels? If I get a new antenna should I go for one up the line from DY6? (DY10 or DY14 for instance)

 

Myswitch indicated I should also get good reception from Melbourne inner suburbs transmitter but the website seems to be down at the moment - I wanted to check the compass direction to see if neighbours 2 storey house is in the way or not - If not, would it be worth pointing my antenna there to see what happens?

Myswitch is back and I see that my antenna would not work with this transmitter (Vertical Polarisation) so forget this idea! (2 storey house is also in the way!)

 

 

Apologies for all the questions, I want to cover all bases - I really do appreciate the replies!

 

Cheers

 

Doo


Edited by doo, 12 August 2014 - 03:14 PM.


#9 M'bozo

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 08:27 PM

 

Got advice on this forum a long time ago (tried to search for it but couldn't find it)

 

http://www.dtvforum....m-interference/



#10 doo

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 10:45 AM

M'bozo - Thanks - you have better forum search skills than I have!

 

So back in 2009 I thought it looked a bit like an OMX400 just like now - except it is a bit different (only has 7 of the narrow elelents - 5 before the first wider one and 2 after it)

So it is from around 2004 - 2005 and may be a superceeded model - and may not be any good for channel 12/ABC

 

I will install a new antenna and see how that goes

 

Alanh recommended a DY10 in the old 2009 post and a DY6 this time (I don't watch Ch31) so which should I use? should I go for the DY10 to be safe or should I go for DY14 and add attenuation if signal is too strong?

 

At the risk of starting a religous war (like iphone vs android)  are Hills the best or are antennas all similar (found Academy TV antennas on the internet with models equivelent to Hills are they any good)??

 

Also checked out my cable that was new around 2004 - 2005. It is RG59 (Belden 9275) and it seems that RG6 is to go nowdays - do I need to upgrade? I am thinking one step at a time - new antenna first and it that solves the issue then stop - but if not then I may need new cable... Thoughts?

 

also - should I leave the Kingray FL3BPMH filter installed - or don't I need it with a new antenna that is just Band 3 ?

 

 

Thanks

 

Doo



#11 alanh

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 12:22 PM

Doo,

The OMX400 is still on the Hills website. It is designed to receive channel 12, however they say the gain varies from 5 - 10 dB but this also includes channel 2.

The DY6 is 7 - 9 dB,  DY10 8 - 11 dB.

 

The OMX400 uses a saddle and screw connector, and I have found that the printed circuit board it is mounted on corrodes over the years. This may be the cause of the poor sensitivity.

 

I originally recommended a DY10, because I was unsure about if you had a significant hill near you. This time you are saying that there is none to your east. I assume there is no multilevel buildings either.

 

Go back to the myswitch website and click on more coverage information, then elevation profile. and see if there is any blockages. 

 

As for the cable, new antennas have an F connector which will require a plug. The plugs have a squeeze fit onto the shield of the cable, most of these plugs are designed to fit quad shielded RG6 cable. There are some available for the thinner cable you have it has to have a smaller inside diameter. As for replacing the cable it depends on its condition particularly outside and the level of interference in your suburb.

 

I would replace the antenna first, the filter can be left in place, and see how it goes. You should only replace the cable if reception is unreliable.

 

I cannot comment on Academy copies of Hills designs.

 

Alanh



#12 doo

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 12:34 PM

Thanks Alanh

 

Myswitch looks OK -  no hills etc between me and the transmitter - only possible issue is some large gum trees in a school ground that are on the transmitter  path and around 100 meters away from my antenna - I wouldnt say they are dense branches and foliage but they are there.

 

Doo



#13 M'bozo

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 08:08 PM

Without measuring with a range of antennas, hard to say which is the most suitable.

 

At a guess, a DY6 or equivalent will probably be satisfactory.

 

The extra gain afforded by a DY10/14 is probably academic, & I would not expect signal overload to be a problem. Plus the DY6 is easier to mount.

 

The Belden RG59 is dual shield & should be satisfactory to begin with. Just make sure to terminate the cable with correct sized F connectors.

 

I would leave the FL3BPMH out to begin with.



#14 doo

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 12:08 PM

OK being armed with too much info can be dangerous!

 

Originally checked Myswitch for someone else and looked up my address to see what it said - that is where I got the idea that my Antenna may not be OK for Channel 12 - as quality had deterioated but I could not say exactly when and myswitch said old antennas may not work for Ch12.

 

Injured leg has recovered enough for me to get on the roof and have a look

 

Not sure why but it seems my antenna was not pointing the right way! Perhaps wind or as storm or something has gradually moved the orientation.

 

I rotated it back to the myswitch bearing (it was out by around 15 degrees or so) checked signal strength on Tivo meter as that is what I used prevously

 

ABC strenght has increrased from 59 to 68 (on the Tivo scale) and the pixilation had stopped - my antenna may not be suitable for ABC on Ch12 but it seems to work

 

ABC is still the lowest signal so I will keep an eye on it for now - if it starts breaking up again in bad weather etc then I may still replace the Antenna.

 

Shouldn't go looking for complex problems until all the basics have been checked!

 

 

Apologies for all my questions but thanks for your answers - I have learned a lot and if I have problems in the future have a plan of attack!

 

 

Doo



#15 alanh

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 07:15 PM

Doo,

If you had something working and now it is not there is usually a cause. This is why I mentioned corrosion. Without seeing the install, and not living in Melbourne, even if I have been there many times, I would not be aware of a strong wind at some time to suggest you check the direction.

 

Good luck

 

Alan



#16 Malich

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 07:43 PM

Doo,

If you had something working and now it is not there is usually a cause. This is why I mentioned corrosion. Without seeing the install, and not living in Melbourne, even if I have been there many times, I would not be aware of a strong wind at some time to suggest you check the direction.

 

Good luck

 

Alan

 

Ah, you got it wrong. Doesn't matter.

 

Treat it as a reminder that asking questions like "Is it pointing in the right direction?" is probably a better first step than just barging right in and saying "You've got the wrong antenna! You need to buy a new one! Or it could be corrosion!".